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Swashbucklers too overpowered

AuthorMessage
Bosun
Apr 28, 2014
382
I'm afraid this debate is far from over now with Contessa...

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9325
Celestialmaster147 on May 22, 2016 wrote:
In my experience, a privateer when played correctly easily beats a buck, witch, and musket. Beating a buck for me is quite simple. Not easy, but simple. Although it may take a long time, I manage to beat them the majority of the time with the shroud tank strategy.

The problem that I have with bucklers is not the fog that everyone complains about, it's the curse that comes from poison, which shuts down my bread and butter.
And you have a counter available to you - Dispel Magic. If you don't choose to use it, well, that's your problem and not the fault of bucklers.

Ensign
Jul 26, 2013
28
Celestialmaster147 on May 22, 2016 wrote:
In my experience, a privateer when played correctly easily beats a buck, witch, and musket. Beating a buck for me is quite simple. Not easy, but simple. Although it may take a long time, I manage to beat them the majority of the time with the shroud tank strategy.

The problem that I have with bucklers is not the fog that everyone complains about, it's the curse that comes from poison, which shuts down my bread and butter.
I understand how it might be that way for you, its just hard for a lot of us. I am pleased and I am sure you are with the new skill in the test realm Blast of Discord which will level the playing feild for us who struggle. Building off what you said about how it takes you awhile that's just the thing, I have beaten people before too it just takes me an hour and not everyone has that kind of time on their hands. I also smiled when I saw the 209 stats on both slashy,stabby,and smashy level 65 weapons in the test realm. This is leaps and bounds for Privateers, I really do think they are taking more steps to make it easier for us.

Stormy Misty Ire 65

Lieutenant
Apr 06, 2016
118
I must say that in my personal opinion Swashbucklers are not the hardest challenge I dealt with as a Buccaneer,Privateers are.To take down a swashbuckler as a buccaneer all you really need is accuracy then just do reckless frenzy,I beat multiple swashbucklers back when I had my max character.So if your a Buccaneer take this hint:Accuracy is the key.

Petty Officer
Jul 25, 2013
75
anecorbie on May 22, 2016 wrote:
And you have a counter available to you - Dispel Magic. If you don't choose to use it, well, that's your problem and not the fault of bucklers.
And they still win. Even in zeal, the chances of me hitting them are incredibly low. Shroud at least offers a chance to win, even without the recovery.

Petty Officer
Jul 25, 2013
75
GoldenNorth on May 23, 2016 wrote:
I understand how it might be that way for you, its just hard for a lot of us. I am pleased and I am sure you are with the new skill in the test realm Blast of Discord which will level the playing feild for us who struggle. Building off what you said about how it takes you awhile that's just the thing, I have beaten people before too it just takes me an hour and not everyone has that kind of time on their hands. I also smiled when I saw the 209 stats on both slashy,stabby,and smashy level 65 weapons in the test realm. This is leaps and bounds for Privateers, I really do think they are taking more steps to make it easier for us.

Stormy Misty Ire 65
Well, I believe that we are using different strategies, since I use the nef staff, so I at least have some reliance with scorpions. As for Blast of Discord, and I know this looks biased, but it is pretty useless, unless the buckler is willing to fog round 1 in rank and I go second. I've used it plenty of times and it has been pretty useless. Keep in mind that nobody in their right mind would stay clumped together for more than a turn since we have something called bombs. I can see that it may have some use, but for the most part I haven't seen it shine brightly.

Petty Officer
Jun 09, 2015
63
Celestialmaster147 on May 24, 2016 wrote:
Well, I believe that we are using different strategies, since I use the nef staff, so I at least have some reliance with scorpions. As for Blast of Discord, and I know this looks biased, but it is pretty useless, unless the buckler is willing to fog round 1 in rank and I go second. I've used it plenty of times and it has been pretty useless. Keep in mind that nobody in their right mind would stay clumped together for more than a turn since we have something called bombs. I can see that it may have some use, but for the most part I haven't seen it shine brightly.
your bombs do more then a thousand damage and your scorpions or is that hacks because someones old scratch while i was fighting the people with the bombs had a one hundred level old scratch minion

Petty Officer
Jun 09, 2015
63
Masonpeev on Jul 18, 2015 wrote:
I have been facing some serious difficulties in this test realm as a buccaneer doing PvP. First of all, we now cannot shield stack which puts a huge huge hole in our defense, and on top of that we can't debuff stack either, which is also a key part of our strategy. This has come for me to say that buccaneer is extremely weak whereas swashbuckler has turned into a no brainer class, all they have to do is go into black fog, (which is still 2x for 5 round when it should be 1.5x for 5 rounds) then apply a curse onto you and your companions, and then all 4 people on the opposing side will just take down your captain, and then they can just easily destroy your companions. Some people may say that you can counter this by going into hidden yourself but if you do this then what the swashbuckler is going to do is kill off your companions, then its 1 vs 4, how is this fair? Not to mention this also destroys privateers because they also, again, shield stack so that they can defend themselves against swashbucklers, but now, there is absolutely no way of defense against this extremely overpowered class
we also have really low health and besides the best defence is a good offence which they say the best offence is a good defence so get a good offence if you can't find a defence swash has low health your litery saying that swash should have no defence and offence and with nothing so help defend themselves they would just die all the time ki gave swash good damage and dodge but low health and swash isn't able to dodge epic mega and super attacks with out black fog and poison its as easy as punching a pillow so stop complaining

Ensign
Mar 14, 2014
45
Lies! swashbuckler's are not over powered they are well balanced.

Petty Officer
Jul 25, 2013
75
mario king on Jun 3, 2016 wrote:
your bombs do more then a thousand damage and your scorpions or is that hacks because someones old scratch while i was fighting the people with the bombs had a one hundred level old scratch minion
Yes, and it is completely countered if you fog, then separate. No, fog is one of the best defenses in the game, as it protects all of your companions from everything but aoe's. Fog is also the only power that can double a whole team's weapon power by 2. Also, a buckler with elusive 3 or even 2 and a fort will be able to tank out a lot of people, so you're not completely defenseless, as the average buckler will carry 3 forts and still carry maybe four assassins and several hides.

Ensign
Dec 21, 2009
7
maybe its not so much that it does too much damage but players simply don't have enough defense. I mean the numbers at this point in the game make 1k damage output seem rather small. most classes can get that out per turn in test realm. so it becomes a game of speed rather than tactics, luckily most of my powers are passive attacks so I am able to maximize damage every round, however to be fair swashbucklers fog should not be nerfed in PVE in PVP however I would say to reduce the round count for how long they are hidden to 2 turns however at the same time it should not be decreased in damage since sometimes its still hard to pull the card. and to circle back around to my original point. Even buccaneers like myself who chose the grizzleheim birthplace to get extra hp still get messed up rather quickly with all this damage getting flung about most people cannot resist I had posted a comment how my peter quint got nearly one shot by swashbuckler non hidden even in pve in test realm when I stated him for hp and armor so what I'm going to say is either buff the shields, the armor and hp, or nerf swash which honestly I don't think should happen either the swashbuckler was meant to be the glass cannon

-Sincerely Mr.Sharp

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9325
Mr Sharp on Jun 4, 2016 wrote:
maybe its not so much that it does too much damage but players simply don't have enough defense. I mean the numbers at this point in the game make 1k damage output seem rather small. most classes can get that out per turn in test realm. so it becomes a game of speed rather than tactics, luckily most of my powers are passive attacks so I am able to maximize damage every round, however to be fair swashbucklers fog should not be nerfed in PVE in PVP however I would say to reduce the round count for how long they are hidden to 2 turns however at the same time it should not be decreased in damage since sometimes its still hard to pull the card. and to circle back around to my original point. Even buccaneers like myself who chose the grizzleheim birthplace to get extra hp still get messed up rather quickly with all this damage getting flung about most people cannot resist I had posted a comment how my peter quint got nearly one shot by swashbuckler non hidden even in pve in test realm when I stated him for hp and armor so what I'm going to say is either buff the shields, the armor and hp, or nerf swash which honestly I don't think should happen either the swashbuckler was meant to be the glass cannon

-Sincerely Mr.Sharp
A decrease to two turns is a limitation that will handicap bucklers badly, making this power useless.
When is Fog best used? When your team is near you.
When does this condition of your team being near you occur? The first round of the match.
How many turns does it take your slowest member to get across the battleboard? More than two rounds.
Therefore Black Fog reduced in turns becomes a useless strategy.
You must come up with ways to prepare for a hidden attack.
Black Fog isn't going to get a nerf just for PVP.

Petty Officer
Jun 09, 2015
63
Celestialmaster147 on Jun 3, 2016 wrote:
Yes, and it is completely countered if you fog, then separate. No, fog is one of the best defenses in the game, as it protects all of your companions from everything but aoe's. Fog is also the only power that can double a whole team's weapon power by 2. Also, a buckler with elusive 3 or even 2 and a fort will be able to tank out a lot of people, so you're not completely defenseless, as the average buckler will carry 3 forts and still carry maybe four assassins and several hides.
then spam bombs and heals

Petty Officer
Jun 09, 2015
63
stop complaining about swashbucklers guys ratbeard said that if we didn't have black fog and the other thing ( forgot ) what do we have yup then all we have is what you can get so stop complaining we all have are strengths and weaknesses so if you can't find a swashes weakness and/or have any strengths its your fault your losing thee reason why swash is winning is because they are using your weaknesses and/or there strengths to beat you so the only one who should be complaining is when your fighting hackers take this for example swash vs priv
priv gets first turn spams bombs swash walks over the fire gets hit two turns gets closer priv spams more bombs swash goes over fire either dies or has low health hits priv and priv has low health ( depends though ) priv spams another bomb swash dies SO STOP COMPLAINING

Ensign
Apr 13, 2013
24
anecorbie on Jul 19, 2015 wrote:
No, we're not. Gosh, you make it sound so easy - just fog, buff and charge and behold! Another win for the "OP" buckler! If it were that easy I would be in the top ranks by now.
However, it's not. Other classes have spent time on strategies to frustrate and defeat the so-called OP buckler. Maybe you should ask them how it's done.
Well since your a swashbuckler, how about you create another character like a buccaneer and then try to defeat a swashbuckler. Then you will know how it feels to have to always be defeated by a buckler. And because you are so OP, every time I'm in skull island or another world like Aquila, I can find a bunch of swashbucklers. plus, swashbucklers don't even have to know what they're doing to defeat someone. All they have to do is click the mouse a few times and that's it. So stop lying that bucklers ain't OP and admit it. Bucklers are too OP and They need a nerf right now.

Hardy Portia Zest- level 65- Buccaneer
Favorite pet: Ram-a-Lam

Lieutenant
Nov 28, 2014
138
mario king on Jun 5, 2016 wrote:
stop complaining about swashbucklers guys ratbeard said that if we didn't have black fog and the other thing ( forgot ) what do we have yup then all we have is what you can get so stop complaining we all have are strengths and weaknesses so if you can't find a swashes weakness and/or have any strengths its your fault your losing thee reason why swash is winning is because they are using your weaknesses and/or there strengths to beat you so the only one who should be complaining is when your fighting hackers take this for example swash vs priv
priv gets first turn spams bombs swash walks over the fire gets hit two turns gets closer priv spams more bombs swash goes over fire either dies or has low health hits priv and priv has low health ( depends though ) priv spams another bomb swash dies SO STOP COMPLAINING
This post was literally from almost a year ago, although they still have an advantage over Buccaneer, it's not as much as it was before on last summer's test realm.

Ensign
Jan 12, 2013
6
Masonpeev on Jun 6, 2016 wrote:
This post was literally from almost a year ago, although they still have an advantage over Buccaneer, it's not as much as it was before on last summer's test realm.
I agree with you, im disappointed really, im a buckler and i just finished fighting a privy. Yes he beat me, how ?? Well first i should say i had used fog, all of my companions were hidden, yes they were, but what did the privy do ? Well he used the power from one of his companions called emmet( i think ), anyways, the power he used was to lower how much i can walk in the battle and it was around 33% less that i could walk which only let me walk 4 squares and even less on my companions. While he was boosting up with the new old scratch power he kept getting stronger and then he would keep firing bombs at me which would do more than 900 damage with old scratch talent, and then the last round i could survive for, he hit me with an epic which did1900 damage with a single bomb attack which almost killed me and my companions, and his companions were still full health and i was still far from him, now how am I supposed to beat that with the low health we have ?? Can someone teach me how to dodge and attack like that ?? Oh wait no cause we can't dodge powers. What's funny is that they say that we can't also use bloods jacket which does a whole bunch of damage but some characters can do same and more damage without it. Also we did get riposte 3 but how come buckler was the only class that didn't get an unique power like the other classes ??
Level 70 swashbuckler

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9325
Abdiel The Cuban on Jun 26, 2016 wrote:
I agree with you, im disappointed really, im a buckler and i just finished fighting a privy. Yes he beat me, how ?? Well first i should say i had used fog, all of my companions were hidden, yes they were, but what did the privy do ? Well he used the power from one of his companions called emmet( i think ), anyways, the power he used was to lower how much i can walk in the battle and it was around 33% less that i could walk which only let me walk 4 squares and even less on my companions. While he was boosting up with the new old scratch power he kept getting stronger and then he would keep firing bombs at me which would do more than 900 damage with old scratch talent, and then the last round i could survive for, he hit me with an epic which did1900 damage with a single bomb attack which almost killed me and my companions, and his companions were still full health and i was still far from him, now how am I supposed to beat that with the low health we have ?? Can someone teach me how to dodge and attack like that ?? Oh wait no cause we can't dodge powers. What's funny is that they say that we can't also use bloods jacket which does a whole bunch of damage but some characters can do same and more damage without it. Also we did get riposte 3 but how come buckler was the only class that didn't get an unique power like the other classes ??
Level 70 swashbuckler
And you stayed bunched together, why didn't you scatter? I would rather have a new talent or addition to an old talent that can be used multiple times over a single use power. Here's a tip, farm Kane for his teleport drops.
BTW, Musketeers didn't get a unique power either.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9325
Hardy Portia Zest on Jun 5, 2016 wrote:
Well since your a swashbuckler, how about you create another character like a buccaneer and then try to defeat a swashbuckler. Then you will know how it feels to have to always be defeated by a buckler. And because you are so OP, every time I'm in skull island or another world like Aquila, I can find a bunch of swashbucklers. plus, swashbucklers don't even have to know what they're doing to defeat someone. All they have to do is click the mouse a few times and that's it. So stop lying that bucklers ain't OP and admit it. Bucklers are too OP and They need a nerf right now.

Hardy Portia Zest- level 65- Buccaneer
Favorite pet: Ram-a-Lam
Howdy, Hardy Portia Zest!
I've just now read your post. I have a max level Buck and have done Ranked PVP against buckler, and won!
Spammed chains and stunned them so that FS and Riposte didn't trigger, also had Pete & Barnabus de-buff their crew.
Maybe you should make a swashbuckler and experience some of the difficulties I've mentioned.
I'm going to pass over your slur against my veracity and suggest that you adhere to the rules of these message boards, and leave personal insults off your posts.
IMO Buccaneers are the top class in PVP. Although that may change with the Blast of Discord trained by Privateers.
Favorite pet: Midnight Cat Cub.
all max level.
Post Edit: I will always maintain that the buckler class needs as much strategy "knowing what they're doing" as any other class.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9325
Lets do a side by side comparison of SB vs. Buck.

1. Shields - Bucks have at least 3 of these at top level and they can stack. SBs have no shields.
2. Team buffs - Bucks have at least 3 of these at top level and have access to one more from Quint and they can stack. SBs have access to only 2 team buffs if they use Fan & El Toro.
3. Attacks - Buck's attack have an accuracy and agility de-buff ( at least 3 ) oh yes, and they can stack. SB attacks don't give a de-buff and no attack can stack, not poison or bleeding.
4. yes we have Black Fog but a) it's a single use, b) it goes away when used, while other damage buffs remain for the entire amount of rounds, c). it doesn't always show up when needed, leaving SBs vulnerable to all attacks.
5. In conclusion: if SB was an OP class in itself & Bucks so UP, why are there SBs training and using Buck weapons and powers? Farming rare gear doesn't make a class OP, as any class can farm rare gear and use it.

Gunner's Mate
Feb 05, 2015
230
Is it just me or are swashbucklers the easiest to beat for a buccaneer. Just use leviathans call and the damage will just me normal. Also spread your companions out a little to avoid them from poisoning you AND your companions.

Commodore
May 31, 2009
873
Hardy Portia Zest on Jun 5, 2016 wrote:
Well since your a swashbuckler, how about you create another character like a buccaneer and then try to defeat a swashbuckler. Then you will know how it feels to have to always be defeated by a buckler. And because you are so OP, every time I'm in skull island or another world like Aquila, I can find a bunch of swashbucklers. plus, swashbucklers don't even have to know what they're doing to defeat someone. All they have to do is click the mouse a few times and that's it. So stop lying that bucklers ain't OP and admit it. Bucklers are too OP and They need a nerf right now.

Hardy Portia Zest- level 65- Buccaneer
Favorite pet: Ram-a-Lam
Look here, friend. I'll freely admit that I'm also a swashbuckler (I've played a buccaneer and a musketeer to max as well), though I'm not one that enjoys the PvP atmosphere; I played a bit when ranked was new, but I decided that it wasn't for me. My reason? I wasn't a fan of it. It's work to make it to the top. I couldn't just shoot up there like you're suggesting all swashbucklers can.

I feel like I can call myself a pretty good player, but I'm outmatched in the ranked arena. Other classes have viable counters and excellent strategies to beat swashies; I've gotten my pirate handed back to me in a jar several times. It takes a bit of planning to beat someone else who thinks just as well as you. You mentioned seeing a lot of swashbucklers around. Yep, it's a very common class since people are drawn to the flashy play style and high damage. We're not as invincible as you're suggesting, though.

I think a lot of people who haven't played swash before have a fundamental misunderstanding of how the class is played. We may have high damage and dodge, as well as some useful hides, but if you're able to hit us, we go down fast since our health is lower than other pirates'. Strategy is huge for swashies. There's more to the class than the ol' "hide & hit" that's played in early to mid story. If we don't play well, we fall hard.

I personally feel that we're balanced with other classes right now. The strength of the pirate depends on the individual player. Many of the swashes in PvP are very good at what they do. We're not "too OP" and we don't particularly need a nerf currently.

I'd also make a personal suggestion to you to stop coloring your posts with personal opinions of other people here. Flat-out calling one of my best friends in the Spiral a liar doesn't sit well with me and I'd hate for that to ruin a friendly mood should we meet in-game. However, I wish you luck in your PvP ventures! If you'd like to have a chat about swash strategy, just ask and we can meet in-game.

Petty Officer
Nov 21, 2012
96
anecorbie on Jun 27, 2016 wrote:
Lets do a side by side comparison of SB vs. Buck.

1. Shields - Bucks have at least 3 of these at top level and they can stack. SBs have no shields.
2. Team buffs - Bucks have at least 3 of these at top level and have access to one more from Quint and they can stack. SBs have access to only 2 team buffs if they use Fan & El Toro.
3. Attacks - Buck's attack have an accuracy and agility de-buff ( at least 3 ) oh yes, and they can stack. SB attacks don't give a de-buff and no attack can stack, not poison or bleeding.
4. yes we have Black Fog but a) it's a single use, b) it goes away when used, while other damage buffs remain for the entire amount of rounds, c). it doesn't always show up when needed, leaving SBs vulnerable to all attacks.
5. In conclusion: if SB was an OP class in itself & Bucks so UP, why are there SBs training and using Buck weapons and powers? Farming rare gear doesn't make a class OP, as any class can farm rare gear and use it.
Not to mention TtT 3. A Buccaneer can get a TtT 3 + Elusive 3 combo by simply spending 2 Training Points and finding a pet that grants Elusive. A Swashbuckler has to spend 2 Training Points, find a pet that grants Elusive and TtT, AND get the Dragon Axe of Doom, and they still would only have Elusive 3 + TtT 2!

Buccaneers are at absolutely no disadvantage when facing a Swashbuckler. The reason Bucks are beat by Swashes more than any other class is because there are more Swashbucklers than other classes. Logically, people would be beaten more by the most numerous class than by the other ones. Any experienced Buck can beat a Swash just as well as an experienced Swash can beat a Buck. In fact, it might be easier for the Buck than it is for the Swash, considering the way things are working out currently.

Ensign
May 24, 2016
9
MistyDragon13 on Jun 27, 2016 wrote:
Look here, friend. I'll freely admit that I'm also a swashbuckler (I've played a buccaneer and a musketeer to max as well), though I'm not one that enjoys the PvP atmosphere; I played a bit when ranked was new, but I decided that it wasn't for me. My reason? I wasn't a fan of it. It's work to make it to the top. I couldn't just shoot up there like you're suggesting all swashbucklers can.

I feel like I can call myself a pretty good player, but I'm outmatched in the ranked arena. Other classes have viable counters and excellent strategies to beat swashies; I've gotten my pirate handed back to me in a jar several times. It takes a bit of planning to beat someone else who thinks just as well as you. You mentioned seeing a lot of swashbucklers around. Yep, it's a very common class since people are drawn to the flashy play style and high damage. We're not as invincible as you're suggesting, though.

I think a lot of people who haven't played swash before have a fundamental misunderstanding of how the class is played. We may have high damage and dodge, as well as some useful hides, but if you're able to hit us, we go down fast since our health is lower than other pirates'. Strategy is huge for swashies. There's more to the class than the ol' "hide & hit" that's played in early to mid story. If we don't play well, we fall hard.

I personally feel that we're balanced with other classes right now. The strength of the pirate depends on the individual player. Many of the swashes in PvP are very good at what they do. We're not "too OP" and we don't particularly need a nerf currently.

I'd also make a personal suggestion to you to stop coloring your posts with personal opinions of other people here. Flat-out calling one of my best friends in the Spiral a liar doesn't sit well with me and I'd hate for that to ruin a friendly mood should we meet in-game. However, I wish you luck in your PvP ventures! If you'd like to have a chat about swash strategy, just ask and we can meet in-game.
Personally, I chose to be a Swashbuckler because I was fascinated by the mystique of it all. I loved the fact you could hide, and contemplated the thought of low health.

Swashbucklers depend on SPEED. If you can't get through the board quickly enough, Fog wears off and then you are kinda screwed. Bucks get Vengeance Strike, so if you use a hide with low health you still have a chance of death. Privateers, Witchdoctors and Musketeers can use things like The Big Guns and Ghostwail. Before you even get to them, they will be insanely buffed!

PRIVATEERS should be nerfed. They buff and buff and buff. Once I was in a pvp match, used fog and by the time I had got to the enemy, I did little to no damage. Witchdoctors have a mad mojo strike (the red blades) idk what they are called. Musketeers get ranged attacks, which is kind of okay. Bucks have a critical hit chain (my Subodai hit about 12 times, all critical). ALL IN ONE ROUND.

So I strongly disagree about Swashbucklers getting nerfed. All classes have HEALING available. Swash only have ONE BLACK FOG. No more, no less.

Scurvy Pearl Parker,
Level 69 Swashbuckler

Bosun
Apr 28, 2014
382
CaptainStars on Aug 1, 2016 wrote:
Personally, I chose to be a Swashbuckler because I was fascinated by the mystique of it all. I loved the fact you could hide, and contemplated the thought of low health.

Swashbucklers depend on SPEED. If you can't get through the board quickly enough, Fog wears off and then you are kinda screwed. Bucks get Vengeance Strike, so if you use a hide with low health you still have a chance of death. Privateers, Witchdoctors and Musketeers can use things like The Big Guns and Ghostwail. Before you even get to them, they will be insanely buffed!

PRIVATEERS should be nerfed. They buff and buff and buff. Once I was in a pvp match, used fog and by the time I had got to the enemy, I did little to no damage. Witchdoctors have a mad mojo strike (the red blades) idk what they are called. Musketeers get ranged attacks, which is kind of okay. Bucks have a critical hit chain (my Subodai hit about 12 times, all critical). ALL IN ONE ROUND.

So I strongly disagree about Swashbucklers getting nerfed. All classes have HEALING available. Swash only have ONE BLACK FOG. No more, no less.

Scurvy Pearl Parker,
Level 69 Swashbuckler
It's not like privateers have tons of buffs, maybe 3 shields with 50% reduction and a valor armor. You can just wait they wear off. And why do you use fog right away? You're making things easier for your opponent.

All classes can get healing, just check accessories at the bazaar.