THEORY: Armada saviors

2
AuthorMessage
Commodore
Sep 20, 2009
814
anecorbie on Jun 6, 2014 wrote:
You would make an excellent prosecutor in the case against pirates! I hope I never have to face a trial where you are making the case! I OBJECT!
I have never pillaged or killed the innocent. Which 'innocent' have I actually harmed? You'll say by starting a war, I have caused many to suffer; consider, though, when we were in Port Regal, there was another group of kidnappers in the sewer. Who sent them? Could it be that the Armada was preparing to begin a war against Marleybone and we simply began it for them?
It takes some time to build a ship, let alone a supership like Rooke's Executioner. I say they were planning to invade before we stepped in.
Our actions were therefore beneficial to Marleybone by causing them to prepare for a war that otherwise would have found them unprepared.
As to Troy, this war had been going on for years before we showed up. A war that was wearing down both sides and costing many lives. It was better to end it. Unfortunately, there has to be a loser.
Encouraging a revolution to an oppressive regime is the act of a hero. Our own history ( United States of America and literature, as well as media supports this hypothesis.)
As to Napoleguin, if there was a better way to handle that situation, I'd like to hear about it. I was only interested in freeing Mustang Sally, that arrogant runt could have rotted there as far as I cared.
AS to killing 'thousands' to stop the Armada, I only recall destroying Armada troops. I didn't even kill Fin ( who certainly deserved it ). And now some pirates have him as a crew member!
And so, zuto4011, I say NO, our pirates are not evil, but flawed, yes, heroic freedom fighters!!!
Most of you points are very good Anecorbie, (sry I forget your pirate name) But...

Okay, so encouraging a revolution to an oppressive regime is the act of a hero. But who decides that the regime was in fact oppressive? Is it really decided by a group of people who are known to live outside of the law to begin with? You say that your own history proves this, but I have to say that it doesn't really since this history was written by those rebels from their own veiw point.

In the 1700's the US colonies were ruled by King George (ack I forget his number), but so too was British North America (BNA) the precurser of Canada. Now, the US colonists decided that the Crown was an oppressive regime, and that they could no longer suffer the indignity of British rule. So they rebelled and created their own republic. Whereas in BNA, the colonists had the opposite view point completely, faced with much of the same laws, they never took on the view that British rule was an oppressive regime. And they never rebelled against it. (sure, we had a minor bar fight over having a consititutional monarchy, but not a revolution). Instead, in the 1800's, the citizens of BNA requested permission from the Crown to creat a new British Dominion with a consititutional monarchy.

Now, today, is Canada really any worse off at all for not overthrowing an "Oppressive regime"?

Consider, the spiral then. We are pirates, living in Skull Island, we're not under the rule of Valencia, or the Armada at all, how in any way can we in decide that the Armada is an oppressive regime. That is entirely upto the Valencians to decide for themselves. And it seems that only a few Valencians have actually decided this to be the case. So, while yes I do agree that we pirates are mostly heroes in the spiral, are we really freedom fighters fighting against an oppressive regime? Or are we simply pirates, fighting to maintain a foothold in the criminal underbelly of the spiral?

And if we are freedom fighters, who's freedom are we ultimatly fighting for? The Valencians' or ours?

Lieutenant
Jun 16, 2009
133
encouraging a revolution and starting one is TREASON, this isn't America where its a constitutional right to over throw a corrupt government

Ok, I know I run the risk of getting a bit political here, but this intrigues me. Americans do not have the Constitutional right to overthrow a corrupt government. However, the Declaration of Independence does state that " it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish" any government that does not protect the rights of the people. This is an Enlightenment idea, so it should have come about in most of the worlds of the Spiral, including Monquista. Of course a corrupt government will oppose a rebellion and call it treason, but that does not make it the wrong thing to do. In Monquista, we helped overthrow a corrupt government that no longer protected the rights of the people. I would say we were the heroes there.

Captain
Feb 02, 2013
721
One-Eyed Jack on Jun 8, 2014 wrote:
Hi! Just one small reminder here . . . combat in Pirate101 is non-lethal. Players and enemies are defeated in combat and not killed. You, and the countless other pirates that come after you, are "teaching a lesson" to the bad guys when you defeat them (with hopes they will change their ways).
the non-lethal policy works in some cases like with the kergha troops, but it just makes no sense for others, do we let animals ruled by instinct and not reason live, what about the undeads new life, do we kill them and end their pitiful new existance or allow the undead to cheat death, what about when we sacked troy, did we let the snakes go with a pat on the head and please dont take vengeance on us for destroying your nation, and what about the ettins in aquila, that club came down pretty hard, that ettin now has a broken skull unless they have harder bones then us in which case the ettin is now in a coma, not to mention we killed the hydra no way you can possibly say cutting off the main head and seeing the rolled over body of the hydra doesnt mean we killed it unless argos is a kill stealer in which case we didnt kill it, and what about the lagooneys and other demons we faced in mooshu, did we let DEMONS live? i think not, we ended threats that would have taken more lives

Administrator
The Hoodoo Master on Jun 8, 2014 wrote:
Not in every case,I'm pretty sure Deacon and Rooke didn't escape and change their ways...

And while I do enjoy seeing a debate like this,make sure it stays a debate,and doesn't turn into an argument(there's a big difference between the two).Try not to get too fiery.Remember:Jack's keeping an eye...
That's a debate from a different thread!

Yes, I totally appreciate the passion for the story, Pirates, but remember to keep things civil and good natured! Remember it's all in good fun.

*One-Eyed Jack, Your Pirate101 Community Manager*
Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5755
CdeWinter on Jun 9, 2014 wrote:
Most of you points are very good Anecorbie, (sry I forget your pirate name) But...

Okay, so encouraging a revolution to an oppressive regime is the act of a hero. But who decides that the regime was in fact oppressive? Is it really decided by a group of people who are known to live outside of the law to begin with? You say that your own history proves this, but I have to say that it doesn't really since this history was written by those rebels from their own veiw point.

In the 1700's the US colonies were ruled by King George (ack I forget his number), but so too was British North America (BNA) the precurser of Canada. Now, the US colonists decided that the Crown was an oppressive regime, and that they could no longer suffer the indignity of British rule. So they rebelled and created their own republic. Whereas in BNA, the colonists had the opposite view point completely, faced with much of the same laws, they never took on the view that British rule was an oppressive regime. And they never rebelled against it. (sure, we had a minor bar fight over having a consititutional monarchy, but not a revolution). Instead, in the 1800's, the citizens of BNA requested permission from the Crown to creat a new British Dominion with a consititutional monarchy.

Now, today, is Canada really any worse off at all for not overthrowing an "Oppressive regime"?

Consider, the spiral then. We are pirates, living in Skull Island, we're not under the rule of Valencia, or the Armada at all, how in any way can we in decide that the Armada is an oppressive regime. That is entirely upto the Valencians to decide for themselves. And it seems that only a few Valencians have actually decided this to be the case. So, while yes I do agree that we pirates are mostly heroes in the spiral, are we really freedom fighters fighting against an oppressive regime? Or are we simply pirates, fighting to maintain a foothold in the criminal underbelly of the spiral?

And if we are freedom fighters, who's freedom are we ultimatly fighting for? The Valencians' or ours?
When I posted about the history of the USA, I knew I would be hearing from our good neighbors in the north! We are not yet under the rule of the Armada, but if we fail, we certainly will be. Do you want that to happen? Do you remember when Britain tried to appease Hitler? ( As an analogy ) War became inevitable through inaction.
I think the answer to the last question is the freedom of the Spiral.

Captain
Feb 02, 2013
721
Only time will tell who is right, until then i keep my belief that the armada is not evil

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5755
CdeWinter on Jun 9, 2014 wrote:
Most of you points are very good Anecorbie, (sry I forget your pirate name) But...

Okay, so encouraging a revolution to an oppressive regime is the act of a hero. But who decides that the regime was in fact oppressive? Is it really decided by a group of people who are known to live outside of the law to begin with? You say that your own history proves this, but I have to say that it doesn't really since this history was written by those rebels from their own veiw point.

In the 1700's the US colonies were ruled by King George (ack I forget his number), but so too was British North America (BNA) the precurser of Canada. Now, the US colonists decided that the Crown was an oppressive regime, and that they could no longer suffer the indignity of British rule. So they rebelled and created their own republic. Whereas in BNA, the colonists had the opposite view point completely, faced with much of the same laws, they never took on the view that British rule was an oppressive regime. And they never rebelled against it. (sure, we had a minor bar fight over having a consititutional monarchy, but not a revolution). Instead, in the 1800's, the citizens of BNA requested permission from the Crown to creat a new British Dominion with a consititutional monarchy.

Now, today, is Canada really any worse off at all for not overthrowing an "Oppressive regime"?

Consider, the spiral then. We are pirates, living in Skull Island, we're not under the rule of Valencia, or the Armada at all, how in any way can we in decide that the Armada is an oppressive regime. That is entirely upto the Valencians to decide for themselves. And it seems that only a few Valencians have actually decided this to be the case. So, while yes I do agree that we pirates are mostly heroes in the spiral, are we really freedom fighters fighting against an oppressive regime? Or are we simply pirates, fighting to maintain a foothold in the criminal underbelly of the spiral?

And if we are freedom fighters, who's freedom are we ultimatly fighting for? The Valencians' or ours?
It was George the Third ( the 'crazy' one ).

Captain
Dec 01, 2012
607
anecorbie on Jun 10, 2014 wrote:
It was George the Third ( the 'crazy' one ).
Wasn't Uranus originally named the Georgium Sidis in his name?

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5755
The Hoodoo Master on Jun 11, 2014 wrote:
Wasn't Uranus originally named the Georgium Sidis in his name?
IDK, astronomy wasn't my subject. I guess I'll look it up, more knowledge is always welcome!

Commodore
Sep 20, 2009
814
anecorbie on Jun 10, 2014 wrote:
It was George the Third ( the 'crazy' one ).
Thanks Anecorbie, that does definetly make sense since the new little Prince George will be King George IV eventually.

Admiral
Jul 27, 2012
1190
Ooo, very good, Felix. That is correct (but I didn't know of 'Georgium Sidus' for years, despite my interest in the past) You are indeed very well read!

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5755
CdeWinter on Jun 11, 2014 wrote:
Thanks Anecorbie, that does definetly make sense since the new little Prince George will be King George IV eventually.
Well, his title will be George VI, George IV was George III's son and I think George V was the present Queen's father or am I wrong? And why has this post degenerated into discussing the lineage of the royals?
I have plenty of speculations about the Armada, but I'll save them for my own post.

Gunner's Mate
Sep 28, 2009
233
zuto4011a on Jun 9, 2014 wrote:
the non-lethal policy works in some cases like with the kergha troops, but it just makes no sense for others, do we let animals ruled by instinct and not reason live, what about the undeads new life, do we kill them and end their pitiful new existance or allow the undead to cheat death, what about when we sacked troy, did we let the snakes go with a pat on the head and please dont take vengeance on us for destroying your nation, and what about the ettins in aquila, that club came down pretty hard, that ettin now has a broken skull unless they have harder bones then us in which case the ettin is now in a coma, not to mention we killed the hydra no way you can possibly say cutting off the main head and seeing the rolled over body of the hydra doesnt mean we killed it unless argos is a kill stealer in which case we didnt kill it, and what about the lagooneys and other demons we faced in mooshu, did we let DEMONS live? i think not, we ended threats that would have taken more lives
Animals ruled by instinct... If you mean like the mobs and stuff, then yes, it's part of the circle of life. You don't see laws enacted to prevent a tiger from killing and eating a zebra. That's something that the game does not focus on as it is not really important to the plot.

undead's new life
If you mean Old Scratch, then we allow him to live to redeem his past ways, and he has clearly done so. As for the mob undeads, they are undead. They can't die from our sword slashes or gun zaps. They may disassemble, but that doesn't declare them dead.

sacked Troy
We never sacked troy at all. That was the Eagles who sacked Troy. We simply came in and assisted in their battle. We never "slayed" any of the snakes. As OEJ said, all combat we are involved always ends in them simply being as you could say KO'd or simply tired out. We have never once "killed" a single enemy in terms of non-mechanical enemies.

Ettins in aquila
Same deal with Troy. We never "slayed" them at all. They are clearly used to getting wacked in the head all the time by a heavy club. They simply get KO'd after the last shot. And I doubt their skulls would be fractured. As said before, they clearly have been used to whacking each other all the time.

killed the Hydra
Once again, we never killed anything. When we finish off the heads, they simply go down while 2 more take its place. You have to remember, KI can alter whatever they want on their content to keep it kid-appropriate. The Hydra in this game does not necessarily have to follow the Hydra in real life, as we all know what really happens to those heads if 2 more take its place. As for the main head, we simply KO it so that it is temporarily dazed while we get what we need.

lagooneys and other demons
And yet one more mention, we have never killed anything.We have simply either KO'd them or fought them to tire them out so they no longer become a threat to us. Those demons have not killed anyone at all. In fact, we have met one demon who was not looking to kill us or anyone at all.

You have to remember, this is KI's content. They alter what they wish in order to keep this kid-appropriate. I can understand where you make these assumptions, but you have to remember about what KI can do to it's content.

Lieutenant
May 19, 2013
104
i like the idea of having a twist as big as that so i have to agree they probably are misunderstood good guys but what if theres more to it than just that, more of a mystery?

Ensign
Apr 05, 2014
27
zuto4011a on Jun 3, 2014 wrote:
I think that the armada IS NOT evil, just misunderstood

1)They try to stop pirates, almost every pirate besides us is "evil"

2) Pollo had said his crew barely escaped el dorado with their lives, and that his crew had no idea of the danger that threatened their lives

3) The builders of el dorado vanished and UNANCHORED the city from the spiral, can you imagine the power it takes to undo the magic that repaired the titans destruction, someone wouldnt do that lightly

4) El dorado may be a tomb or a prison meant to CONTAIN this great danger

5) The armada may be do some bad things like destroy islands and take peoples freedom, but wouldnt LOGICAL robots do whatever it took to save ALL of the spiral

6) Robots with the strongest navy dont need money, so why would they go to el dorado?

I have suggested this to blind mew, his response was interesting theory, but that would be telling

But now i want to hear your opinions message boards

-Robert level 65 privateer, Team EPIC

I
I'm what you would call "Neutral" on this topic P.S whats team EPIC?

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