Well that was fast x_x I've yet to test it out myself but did the number of less charges help at all? Or is charge just too oppressive to keep on the warriors? Surely they stopped the turn 1 leviathans calls so that's a step in the right direction where they harder to kill than normal? 1 big guns from my privateer would drop them to 60% and if they used call the would be able to survive repel boarders/ overwatch

Ratbeard on Aug 12, 2015 wrote:

It's not possible for them to "save" their Vicious Charge. It's either in their deck or it's not.

If you're seeing otherwise, it's a bug.

Please confirm.

Ok thank you for that info as that part wasn't added to the update notes let us test that now.

Ratbeard on Aug 12, 2015 wrote:

It's not possible for them to "save" their Vicious Charge. It's either in their deck or it's not.

If you're seeing otherwise, it's a bug.

Please confirm.

I really think it's cool what you did but you really just need to ban it just because some lucky people got he robe after farming does not mean every one else should lose to it or rage because of it #banrobe

TechnomagePvP on Aug 12, 2015 wrote:

K we gave it a shot and tested the warrior's out in PvP we found the Robe's STILL AS POWEFUL AS EVER...

Still a nice ratio of around 1:3 of the warriors don't use there charge off the bat.... This is useless all this accomplished was the warriors SAVING there vicious so not even Technomage goggles is a decent balance to these.....

You should just either
A: Change the Vicious Charge to Mighty Charge
B: Remove Vicious Completely....

haha how about no. i love the fact that some don't use it right off the bat. it helps in some fights like the nefarious fight. say they don't hit all of them then the back up come and hits the last. i hope you do realize not everything in this game is about pvp and they are not going to change it because its unfair in JUST pvp. before you start digging in to the pvp side look into the side (like mine) that doesn't pvp. how would this affect us? would it make it easier or harder for us? would we agree? i see allot of people complaining about how something is unfair in pvp without thinking about how this would affect pve and due to people constantly complaining about how it ruins pve KI changes it and it makes pve harder which in the long run will make it harder questing when the new world comes. all im asking is just think about how this affects pve and pvp people before you want it changed. i use moo's robe allot because of this, they die fast and i need back up warriors to finish the job. i do agree sometimes with some posts that need stuff to be changed. something that everyone would like would be to take away moo's robe from ranked pvp. both sides win. pve get what they farmed for and lots of people are happy its gone from ranked and those who aren't can easily change strategy. not trying to call you out for anything or start a argument i just want to stop seeing posts here were the person complaining doesn't think of pve at all.

-jack nightingale lvl 65 buccaneer

i think I can confirm for sure that the fix doesn't work as intended. They save their Vicious Charge for later, in other words, their Vicious never goes away.

Sincerely,
Stubborn Duncan Freeman

We'll investigate.

I've been testing the effect of Moo Robes + Nefarious Staff + Grizzled Heart Banner on my witchdoctor and I must say that the above equation almost always = victory.
In fact out of six bouts my only defeat occurred against a swashbuckler with Black Fog. It seems BF is the only counter to this 'strategy' and since only SB have this power, it would indicate an imbalance in PVP.
I, too, have noticed the automatic use of Leviathan Call in the first round freeze. After, which they will always charge.

anecorbie on Aug 13, 2015 wrote:

I've been testing the effect of Moo Robes + Nefarious Staff + Grizzled Heart Banner on my witchdoctor and I must say that the above equation almost always = victory.
In fact out of six bouts my only defeat occurred against a swashbuckler with Black Fog. It seems BF is the only counter to this 'strategy' and since only SB have this power, it would indicate an imbalance in PVP.
I, too, have noticed the automatic use of Leviathan Call in the first round freeze. After, which they will always charge.

If Fog is the ONLY "counter" to your "strategy", then wouldn't witchdoctors be providing an imbalance to PvP aswell?

Also if I can just mention something, I wouldn't consider a "counter" is a literal "counter" in regard to strategies, but rather "a viable way to DEAL WITH an opponents approach to win a match".

I personally think such words have been held to such meanings that the word don't fully support. The "black and white" definition the word has doesn't take into account all of "the gray" (situational "what ifs" for lack of a better term), so I think it is good to leave it open for broader interpretation.

Also, I strongly believe in as balanced game as possible, and I would not jump on any "train" until a sufficient enough sample size has produced results to support my thoughts. That said, I personally believe nothing "game changing" should be implemented until the end of each season. If the results echo the community's voices, then change WILL occur.

If everyone would just STOP and truly THINK about things and the BIG picture of pvp (ALL 5 classes, all 15 possible matchups) BEFORE they makes "rants" and huge assumptions and irrational conclusions, then possibly I'd be more willing to hear them out. (This was not directed at any one person, but something for everyone to see because quite frankly, it should be at the top of your mind with every pvp related post. Just my opinion, although it could very well be factual.)

Wolf SkullRider on Aug 13, 2015 wrote:

If Fog is the ONLY "counter" to your "strategy", then wouldn't witchdoctors be providing an imbalance to PvP aswell?

Also if I can just mention something, I wouldn't consider a "counter" is a literal "counter" in regard to strategies, but rather "a viable way to DEAL WITH an opponents approach to win a match".

I personally think such words have been held to such meanings that the word don't fully support. The "black and white" definition the word has doesn't take into account all of "the gray" (situational "what ifs" for lack of a better term), so I think it is good to leave it open for broader interpretation.

Also, I strongly believe in as balanced game as possible, and I would not jump on any "train" until a sufficient enough sample size has produced results to support my thoughts. That said, I personally believe nothing "game changing" should be implemented until the end of each season. If the results echo the community's voices, then change WILL occur.

If everyone would just STOP and truly THINK about things and the BIG picture of pvp (ALL 5 classes, all 15 possible matchups) BEFORE they makes "rants" and huge assumptions and irrational conclusions, then possibly I'd be more willing to hear them out. (This was not directed at any one person, but something for everyone to see because quite frankly, it should be at the top of your mind with every pvp related post. Just my opinion, although it could very well be factual.)

WDs without the advantages of the Staff or Moo's Robes are at a severe disadvantage against most of the classes in PVP: I bought a 24 pass for my WD and began using the combo this morning I reported preliminary results while the facts were still fresh in my mind - this was not intended as a 'rant' or complaint, but honest 'just the facts, please' reporting so that RB and KI developers can know about a problem and fix it.
I sincerely believe that Moo's Robes fit the "OP" definition in all ways, but if I should find another strategy that counters ( as in renders them as a moot point ) in the bout I will certainly report it.
I have defeated a SB in BF using the above strategy, but it was due, imo, to luck and the recent change to FS3.

Ratbeard on Aug 12, 2015 wrote:

It's not possible for them to "save" their Vicious Charge. It's either in their deck or it's not.

If you're seeing otherwise, it's a bug.

Please confirm.

I can confirm. Only 1/2 actual terror cottas "save" their vicious charges, but the mechanics for their levy call and the supposed 50% chance to not have the charge are not functioning correctly. This was annoying to deal with, especially against a buckler .

anecorbie on Aug 13, 2015 wrote:

WDs without the advantages of the Staff or Moo's Robes are at a severe disadvantage against most of the classes in PVP: I bought a 24 pass for my WD and began using the combo this morning I reported preliminary results while the facts were still fresh in my mind - this was not intended as a 'rant' or complaint, but honest 'just the facts, please' reporting so that RB and KI developers can know about a problem and fix it.
I sincerely believe that Moo's Robes fit the "OP" definition in all ways, but if I should find another strategy that counters ( as in renders them as a moot point ) in the bout I will certainly report it.
I have defeated a SB in BF using the above strategy, but it was due, imo, to luck and the recent change to FS3.

I didn't read it as a rant, don't worry. However I did read something that I wished to comment on, which I did. From what I read, your witchdoctor strategy was practically unbeatable in your series of matches, except by that swashbuckler. You stated that Fog was able to "counter" this, though I believe it would be more fitting to say that "black fog is an effective power for dealing with the mass amount of summons".

I meant no disrespect or rudeness by my comment, but what I said was why I even replied to your post.

This miscommunication in "tone" and what I actually meant is a perfect example of what I was trying to say in the first place, not everything in PvP is simply blue. Things can be sky blue, aqua, navy blue etc. A whole plethora of things has to be taken into account when listening to others opinions on how x affects y and how z will ultimately change... The same goes with communication, so I hope I've "cleared" up any confusion there might have been in my reply, and I apologize for my lack of clarity to begin with.

Patience288 on Aug 14, 2015 wrote:

This is to all the people who fled after the nefarious battle and deserted your team. I would say that the majority of the people who stayed and didn't bail on their team have the moo robe. I also bet that the people complaining about the robe are the ones who fled. Well now it's coming back to haunt you maybe next time you will be a team player. Another thing I really feel sorry for the ones who wanted to stay and farm moo but couldn't because they were short a player or many times two. I just hope this is justice for all of us who did stay and fought hard for that robe.

I completely agree with this statement Patience288! The number of runs that got cut off by those only willing to farm the Nefarious Five ( or those wanting the Badge ) added more stress and agro when I was running the Tower. And it was really short-sighted and silly of them when it was just one extra floor until you met Moo! ( Mind you, that extra floor was the Terror-Cotta floor. )