The Gold Monkey Crystals and Kane's Machine

AuthorMessage
Ensign
Jun 29, 2009
3
Hey guys! Haven't seen many new posts in Message Boards, and perhaps I'm slightly late. But, after defeating Kane yet once again (and believe me not getting his mask), I asked myself...
Why would Kane Need the crystals from the gold monkey valley to power his machine?
After doing some research, I found that yes we did get to talk to our parents in the Gortez dungeon (where they are found.) However, I never found the correlation between the crystals and Kane's massive destruction machine. Does anyone have some insights on this?

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
Justin Firethief on Mar 3, 2017 wrote:
Hey guys! Haven't seen many new posts in Message Boards, and perhaps I'm slightly late. But, after defeating Kane yet once again (and believe me not getting his mask), I asked myself...
Why would Kane Need the crystals from the gold monkey valley to power his machine?
After doing some research, I found that yes we did get to talk to our parents in the Gortez dungeon (where they are found.) However, I never found the correlation between the crystals and Kane's massive destruction machine. Does anyone have some insights on this?
No insight but plenty of speculations:
The crystals seem magical in nature, they can summon voices from the spirit world. I've seen similar crystals in the Dark Crawler instance; maybe crystals link the physical world with the spiritual world?
Crystals may be used to store energy or power machines?
And are those crystals in the Machine really from the Gold Mine? Couldn't Old Scratch have been fooled? I'm highly suspicious of our parent's final message of not seeking El Dorado, when they specifically said that they were waiting for us.

Ensign
Jun 29, 2009
3
anecorbie on Mar 4, 2017 wrote:
No insight but plenty of speculations:
The crystals seem magical in nature, they can summon voices from the spirit world. I've seen similar crystals in the Dark Crawler instance; maybe crystals link the physical world with the spiritual world?
Crystals may be used to store energy or power machines?
And are those crystals in the Machine really from the Gold Mine? Couldn't Old Scratch have been fooled? I'm highly suspicious of our parent's final message of not seeking El Dorado, when they specifically said that they were waiting for us.
This is what I was thinking! Even though I feel KI will take some time to release Arc 2, I feel some "conspiracy" theories aren't bad lol. Anyways, when the dungeon ends with our parents saying we should not go to El Dorado, and Old Scratch reassuring that it was "our" parents that were the ones actually talking to us, I became skeptical. If we remember when we defeated Kane and the machine took his golden brain Old Scratch specifically says "Kanes brain is taken far away from here, Mighty Mojo is needed" so how about if Scratch was wrong after all and the voices from the crystals were manipulated by some "El Dorado" spirit, or in other words, manipulated by Kane Himself?

On a more extreme note, I started investigating the Gortez Dungeon, and realized that he was somewhat possessed by "something". According to the puppet shows it was the Gold Monkey Hand, but I have a theory otherwise. When we talk to our parents in the crystal mines, they want us to find their graves in El Dorado. When they're going to tell us where they cut out, what if the crystals have some sort of enchantment from El Dorado, or what if something else keeps haunting these crystals that keeps preventing us to get there? Also to keep in mind that Catbeard knows everything that happened in El Dorado, and Kane killing his "creator" also seems highly suspicious, why didn't he do it before rather than keep him as a prisoner? As Blind Mew said, there is a door open for many questions left unanswered, but I still like the suspense, to keep myself entertained. Why would Kane need the crystals? Was old Scratch deceived?

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
Justin Firethief on Mar 5, 2017 wrote:
This is what I was thinking! Even though I feel KI will take some time to release Arc 2, I feel some "conspiracy" theories aren't bad lol. Anyways, when the dungeon ends with our parents saying we should not go to El Dorado, and Old Scratch reassuring that it was "our" parents that were the ones actually talking to us, I became skeptical. If we remember when we defeated Kane and the machine took his golden brain Old Scratch specifically says "Kanes brain is taken far away from here, Mighty Mojo is needed" so how about if Scratch was wrong after all and the voices from the crystals were manipulated by some "El Dorado" spirit, or in other words, manipulated by Kane Himself?

On a more extreme note, I started investigating the Gortez Dungeon, and realized that he was somewhat possessed by "something". According to the puppet shows it was the Gold Monkey Hand, but I have a theory otherwise. When we talk to our parents in the crystal mines, they want us to find their graves in El Dorado. When they're going to tell us where they cut out, what if the crystals have some sort of enchantment from El Dorado, or what if something else keeps haunting these crystals that keeps preventing us to get there? Also to keep in mind that Catbeard knows everything that happened in El Dorado, and Kane killing his "creator" also seems highly suspicious, why didn't he do it before rather than keep him as a prisoner? As Blind Mew said, there is a door open for many questions left unanswered, but I still like the suspense, to keep myself entertained. Why would Kane need the crystals? Was old Scratch deceived?
You misquoted Old Scratch, it's "Mighty Mojo indeed."
Kane couldn't risk killing Gazpacio, because he didn't know where Gazpacio had hidden the Golden Heart, once the Golden Heart was revealed, then it was safe to kill Gazpacio.
Crystals "cutting out" in midsentence may have had something more to do with their connection in the physical world.
Blind Mew also said "Question everything about those crystals" maybe those crystals didn't come from the Gold Mine.
Gold Monkey Hand? I think you're mixing up the Monkey's Paw with the Gold Monkey treasure Gortez was supposed to find, anyway that was the temple itself ( if you look at the temple before you go in, you'll see it has a giant monkey head on it. )

Admiral
Jul 07, 2013
1124
He used them as a power source because they were Dilithium lol!

Virtuous Dante Ramsey

Ensign
Jun 11, 2016
16
Aye, I might be a little late replying to this thread, but, have those of you who were discussing things here noticed that the crystals (in The Machine) that summoned the vision of our parents seemed to be projecting the same pinkish-purplish lightning and energy that removed The Brain from Kane's body? I find this to be no coincidence and it has (along with other evidence, IE; the contradictory opinions on whether or not we should head to ElDorado) lead me to believe that these are not the crystals from the Gold Monkey Valley, Old Scratch's assumption that they were seems to be red herring (in relation to the plot), then again, until they do reveal what the crystals are, we can only make assumptions.

By the way: May someone remind me if the lightning around the crystals in The Machine is also present in the Gold Monkey Valley instance? Thanks in advance.

-Valkoor Renner

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
Valkoor the Swashb... on Mar 16, 2017 wrote:
Aye, I might be a little late replying to this thread, but, have those of you who were discussing things here noticed that the crystals (in The Machine) that summoned the vision of our parents seemed to be projecting the same pinkish-purplish lightning and energy that removed The Brain from Kane's body? I find this to be no coincidence and it has (along with other evidence, IE; the contradictory opinions on whether or not we should head to ElDorado) lead me to believe that these are not the crystals from the Gold Monkey Valley, Old Scratch's assumption that they were seems to be red herring (in relation to the plot), then again, until they do reveal what the crystals are, we can only make assumptions.

By the way: May someone remind me if the lightning around the crystals in The Machine is also present in the Gold Monkey Valley instance? Thanks in advance.

-Valkoor Renner
The lightening wasn't present in the Gold Mine, but that was because they were in their natural setting; not plugged into a machine.
It's not surprising to me that the pinkish/purple lightening was present when removing the Golden Mind and projecting our parent's voices/images as it was all part of the same machine.
We're assuming that the Mind was returned to El Dorado, but isn't it possible that it was taken by someone who also believes the Spiral is a corrupted mess and needs to be purified or restored to its original form of the First World?
If you have played W101 through to Mirage, you'll understand why I think Grandfather Spider may have had a hand in this.

Ensign
Jun 11, 2016
16
Aye, that is a logical explanation to the lightning thing, yet I don't believe that Grandfather Spider has a hand in this, yes, the particles look similar to when he poisoned Bartleby and unleashed his children into the spiral at the end of Khrysalis, but I don't they'd do something like that in P101, they seem to be 'different dimensions,' so to speak. Would it be awesome for a villain to crossover like that?; Absolutely, but I highly doubt that they would. 'Tis a pity. And, yes, I have played through Mirage.

Ensign
Jun 11, 2016
16
Aye, there is something else I'd like to add, the lightning/'whatever that chaotic power was,' plucked the brain from Kane's body, and I have thought of an explanation for it that can 'kill two birds with one stone,' what if the brain was installed into the Queen's body as a way to keep Kane's goals going? It could possibly explain what happened to the brains as well as, though it is unrelated, the resurrection of the Queen. Seems plausible, no? It's all theoretical, and something makes me think the Queen will be one of the next Arc's Big Bads.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
Valkoor the Swashb... on Mar 18, 2017 wrote:
Aye, that is a logical explanation to the lightning thing, yet I don't believe that Grandfather Spider has a hand in this, yes, the particles look similar to when he poisoned Bartleby and unleashed his children into the spiral at the end of Khrysalis, but I don't they'd do something like that in P101, they seem to be 'different dimensions,' so to speak. Would it be awesome for a villain to crossover like that?; Absolutely, but I highly doubt that they would. 'Tis a pity. And, yes, I have played through Mirage.
If you replay the puppet show about the Duck of Death, you'll see the "Evil Spirit from the time before there was a Spiral" has spider eyes.
Blind Mew has posted that the events of Pirate and Wizard are closely linked in time. We get to MooShu before the Wizard heals the Emperor. We find out that Sherlock Bones is still "dealing with the fall-out from the Krokonomicon affair" so he's not available to decode the clockwork birds; we have to consult Meowiarty. ( He would make a great arc villain, also. )
The Aztecosaurs of Xol Akmul fled the Cataclysm of Xibalba and at first assume that we're agents of the Shadow Queen. ( Morganth. )
It's not as far fetched that we may think that we will get a Wizard villain. ( Equally we may not get one, we need to wait and see. )

Ensign
Jun 11, 2016
16
That is true, so, yeah, regarding your points, Old Cob/Grandfather Spider could play a hand in this. Thanks for reminding me of that stuff, clearly, I've overlooked it.

Ensign
Jun 11, 2016
16
Too add, that, "We need to wait and see" thing you said holds a lot of worth in all of these speculations about current things in the plot, and, since I didn't comment before in my other reply about some of the things you have said, I do agree that Meowiarty would make a great arc villain, even if he became one of my favorite NPCs after the end of the Aquila arc.

Lieutenant
Mar 23, 2012
183
Personally, I stopped playing W101 when I got to the Jabberwocky/Bandersnatch dungeon in Avalon and couldn't solo it (before team up and the Kiosk that everyone is going plantains over,) so I can't comment on this Grandfather Spider you speak of.

My assumption has always been that the Grand Design's AI took Kane's brain as a fail safe in the event of his destruction so that he can be uploaded in a fashion to the Grand Design in order to command the armada in a body of his own creation, as it were. That way he can repair it, reprogram it to follow his exact orders on the fly and head off to El Dorado whilst our pirates celebrate the illusion of his defeat.

Admiral
Oct 27, 2009
1286
I was wondering if these crystals might be related to whatever powers our spark shooters. Maybe our guns just contain a teeny tiny chip of them. If it can store energy, maybe it can store other things, mojo things? Maybe act like a jinni's bottle? If so, really don't want to see what the pink eyeballs would do if totally free ... or maybe we do.

Captain
Sep 19, 2012
625
nice thinking all of ye.. is it positive that Kane destroyed the golden heart? or maybe zapped it to somewhere else unseen before he killed G?

also right before i did this dungeon(solo its horrid dont try this yes i won but barely 0 fun like that yes bought a henchman yes on my swash) I did a side quest i had missed before in Aquila where you burn harpy feathers at the god's statues as offerings for god's blessings, which ended up being trivia.. one i remember that seemed directly related to this was when burning at talos to honor hephestus, he gets grumpy with us and says "only when the hand, eye and heart are rejoined again and work as one will i forgive you" or close to that.. but it never said anything about the mind? G "fixed" the mind but hephaestus never mentioned the mind so am i off track here? what made me think its related was in that same quest apollo refers to desdemona as necessary..

thoughts?

stormy jen silver

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
stormyjensilverdra... on Mar 30, 2017 wrote:
nice thinking all of ye.. is it positive that Kane destroyed the golden heart? or maybe zapped it to somewhere else unseen before he killed G?

also right before i did this dungeon(solo its horrid dont try this yes i won but barely 0 fun like that yes bought a henchman yes on my swash) I did a side quest i had missed before in Aquila where you burn harpy feathers at the god's statues as offerings for god's blessings, which ended up being trivia.. one i remember that seemed directly related to this was when burning at talos to honor hephestus, he gets grumpy with us and says "only when the hand, eye and heart are rejoined again and work as one will i forgive you" or close to that.. but it never said anything about the mind? G "fixed" the mind but hephaestus never mentioned the mind so am i off track here? what made me think its related was in that same quest apollo refers to desdemona as necessary..

thoughts?

stormy jen silver
I truly believe the Golden Heart was destroyed, just as Kane destroyed his "father". The Temple Round quest was designed to give us some "foreshadowing" of what was coming up in VA2 before the re-write.
I think ( only speculating here ) that Hephaestus' prediction no longer applies since the Heart was destroyed and the Hand was killed.

Bosun
Dec 28, 2012
300
stormyjensilverdra... on Mar 30, 2017 wrote:
nice thinking all of ye.. is it positive that Kane destroyed the golden heart? or maybe zapped it to somewhere else unseen before he killed G?

also right before i did this dungeon(solo its horrid dont try this yes i won but barely 0 fun like that yes bought a henchman yes on my swash) I did a side quest i had missed before in Aquila where you burn harpy feathers at the god's statues as offerings for god's blessings, which ended up being trivia.. one i remember that seemed directly related to this was when burning at talos to honor hephestus, he gets grumpy with us and says "only when the hand, eye and heart are rejoined again and work as one will i forgive you" or close to that.. but it never said anything about the mind? G "fixed" the mind but hephaestus never mentioned the mind so am i off track here? what made me think its related was in that same quest apollo refers to desdemona as necessary..

thoughts?

stormy jen silver
The original story was to spend books 16 - 17 gathering parts to build another super clockwork named Abel that would require these pieces. This was sadly cut from the story due to reasons. (Book 15 would have been getting Gazpaccio out of Va. Book 18 would be entering the Machine for the final map pieces but Abel would fail and G and him would both be killed. Book 19 would be chasing Kane to El Dorito because he would now have all the map pieces. And book 20 would be a final showdown with Kane in the golden city.)

All information above can be found in Blind Mew's wonderful post So About Book 15...

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
8699
stormyjensilverdra... on Mar 30, 2017 wrote:
nice thinking all of ye.. is it positive that Kane destroyed the golden heart? or maybe zapped it to somewhere else unseen before he killed G?

also right before i did this dungeon(solo its horrid dont try this yes i won but barely 0 fun like that yes bought a henchman yes on my swash) I did a side quest i had missed before in Aquila where you burn harpy feathers at the god's statues as offerings for god's blessings, which ended up being trivia.. one i remember that seemed directly related to this was when burning at talos to honor hephestus, he gets grumpy with us and says "only when the hand, eye and heart are rejoined again and work as one will i forgive you" or close to that.. but it never said anything about the mind? G "fixed" the mind but hephaestus never mentioned the mind so am i off track here? what made me think its related was in that same quest apollo refers to desdemona as necessary..

thoughts?

stormy jen silver
Also, the Mind was located in Kane's Head; so there's Hephaestus' prediction linked up.
Head = Golden Mind
Heart = Golden Heart
Hand = Gazpaccio
Of course, I could be completely wrong, but that's my interpretation.