Pirates in Wizard: Did It Really Happen? (spoiler)

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AuthorMessage
Petty Officer
Dec 21, 2008
51
This evening, a bunch of fellow wizards and pirates and I were discussing the latest update in Wizard101. For those that don't know, the Maestro, an evil, time-tampering foe, decides to choose six critical points in the Spiral's history and try to change them for his benefit. One of the times he picks is before the beginning of the Pirate101 story. He captures Boochbeard and Gandry and hands them over to Deacon, who is not so trusting that [spoiler] the pirate Boochbeard and Gandry will rescue will one day defeat the Armada. Not wanting to take any chances, he keeps them anyway. However, our wizards appear and battle clockwork marines, including one elite marine, before suggesting that Boochbeard and Gandry go and save our pirate.

The whole Wizard vs. Pirate thing is pretty big. It's all in fun, of course, but we pose legitimate questions and ideas. The newest thing is that if it weren't for our wizards, our pirate would have never been rescued by Boochbeard and Gandry.

One theory is that they WOULD have, but the Maestro changed the past, so in our efforts to fix it, we bypassed that reality and instead have a new one (the same one we were in before), but we changed HOW we got there. Therefore, our wizards are indeed now responsible for our pirate journey (though not before the Maestro).

Another theory is that the Maestro's events and changes led to an alternate reality that leaves our wizards actually separated from our pirates, meaning they are NOT responsible for the rescue of our pirates.

"King Artorious" (a.k.a. Jesse Scoble) has been eyeing our conversation and supported the idea of a thread here. Perhaps Blind Mew will provide a little more insight as to whether this type of thing would even be considered, and whether or not the events in Wizard actually happened.

Let what is "real" be defined as what is contained within our current reality, and not an alternate reality. Should our pirates and wizards ever interact in the future, we will know that they are currently in the same reality, and thus proving the events to be real and our wizards to be responsible for the pirate rescue. But until then, can anyone provide insight on this? Is the past in which Boochbeard and Gandry discovered us by other means no more with our wizard having now had to bypass the Maestro's changes to time?

First Mate
Oct 27, 2009
458
I think Boochbeard and Gandry would have rescued us without the Maestro and wizard's influence. That is how the professor knew what needed to be fixed. The professor was just having us restore what happened before. Our rescuers knew they were to rescue an orphan, but not where, when, or who. They sailed around like they would have anyway. Perhaps they knew slightly more, that there is an orphan they should rescue, but it seems like something they would have done anyway. No big change, just a small blip for Boochbeard and Gandry.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5757
This is an intriguing proposition, my highest level wizard is only level 49. I noticed in the Marleybone BOX quest, that all of the bosses resembled the bosses we fight in P101 ( including one who looks like the Underdog )!
We have had hints in the P101 storyline that we are running currently with W101 events.
Maybe the Professor should pay Skull Island a visit?
P.S. I love the Dr. Who reference, he even is dressed like my favorite Dr.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 10, 2009
6079
I think the wizards did indeed influence Boochbeard & Gandry. In the beginning they are looking for a particular pirate for a reason. I think they overheard the conversation with Deacon and Maestro and knew that they HAD and would rescue this orphan in order to end the Armada's threat to the Spiral. Kind of like Harry Potter "Knowing" he could product the patronus because he saw it in another time. Boochbeard & Gandry "knew" they would rescue the right pirate and that is why they keep checking up on us as they know we are also "The Chosen One" to defeat the evil that threatens their world.

Lieutenant
Jun 16, 2009
133
This is a classic time paradox. I tend to favor the Professor's explanation of situations like this. Time is in flux.Things change in the future or the past and shift the entirety of the time stream on to a different path. What may or may not have happened before becomes simply a what if, irrelevant to reality. Our wizards did influence our pirates lives. That is what happened in this version of time.
Now, because our wizard has traveled in the B.O.X., they will probably remember some alternate form of reality, even if only a small thing changed. Our pirate, however, will only know what happened. That is, they will only remember that they were rescued by Boochbeard and Gandry and whatever might have happened is not part of their life.

Lieutenant
Jun 16, 2009
133
Or we could just stick to the Professor's simpler explanation. It's all just wibbely- wobblely timey- wimey stuff.

Commodore
May 31, 2009
801
SHHHH I haven't had time to do more than the Wizard City one! Oh well, spoilers are great fun, especially when you get to be the one doing the spoiling! My problem right now is that I don't have a membership to Wizard101-- The only two quests I'm able to do are the Wizard City and Marleybone ones.

Perhaps it is all just wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey stuff.

Or perhaps this theory is indeed correct, but thinking about that would give me a headache. All this alternate reality and false reality and multiple reality stuff, yuck.

Which world does the Professor give this quest in? If it's past Marleybone, I won't be able to complete it, or even start it for that matter.

EXTERMINATE!!!

How did that sneak in here...?

Captain
Jun 26, 2010
586
This topic couldn't be more interesting, I too competed in the B.O.X challenges and had me guessing too.

- Deadeye Jack Morgan

Captain
Dec 11, 2010
740
I personally believe that everything that happens cannot be changed and the path if altered in anyway would always correct itself as that is what is suppose to happen in the first place.
For example, if El Toro was destined to eat a yum cake (That sounds yummy :O ) tomorrow then after any and all decisions he will eat the yum cake.

Timetraveling puts you in the point that your present (as in you, not the version of you that exists in that timeline if one does) at a point it was destined to be at. So the B.O.X.E.S. event actually did in fact save our or someone else's pirate which already happened timewise.

Ensign
Jun 13, 2014
48
Wibbly wobbly timey wimey.

Lieutenant
Sep 17, 2012
102
Here is the way I see it.

There is no "real" timeline, just alternate ones. When the Maestro went back and messed with the events of the past, a new timeline branched off from the old one. As a result, this creates a paradox that is really up to interpretation.

My pirate was created well before the BOXES event was released, so I envision my pirate as living in the original timeline. Also the Maestro's goal was to ALTER the past, which means that it happened differently originally. When he is stopped the new alternate timeline continues, but the original one still exists.

Developer
"King Artorious" (a.k.a. Jesse Scoble) has been eyeing our conversation and supported the idea of a thread here. Perhaps Blind Mew will provide a little more insight as to whether this type of thing would even be considered, and whether or not the events in Wizard actually happened..."
- Swordroll

If you guys know me at all, then you surely have learned by now that giving definitive answers to even the most simple yes or no questions is anathema to my basic nature. That said, i shall now provide you with several points that may or may not satisfy y'all's curiosity...

As to whether or not these events really happened, well they must have, in some form, because the Maestro knew to contact the Armada in the first place. So he did know that your Pirate will be critical in the final battle with the Armada, even if the eventual victory he was threatening them with might not be certain. I'm a big fan of closed loop paradoxes, where events set themselves in motion and ideas or objects just materialize out of nothing. A classic example from a DnD game i heard about (but never played): a character received a magical ring from a mysterious stranger when he was a child. Later, through a twist of fate he happened upon a young boy and gave him that ring... and the boy was himself. So where the heck did that ring come from? Who made it? I love that stuff. It ain't a paradox if you can explain it.

More to come...

Developer
(continued)

In the alternate ending of the 12 Monkeys script that was floating around in my head, I would have written it so that Cole himself was the source of the plague - he picked it up at the beginning of the movie, infected everyone in the refuge with it, and then spread it to the past world at precisely the point the future folks sent him to. And that, my friends, is why you don't do time travel. Just don't.

Digression over. I love closed loops that create something out of nothing, but I also dig the notion of changing the future - I love the Terminator films (at least, the 2 good ones) too much to dismiss mutable time. So, the Maestro's intervention either made the PC the crucial figure in defeating the Armada, or it would have happened anyway, just differently. Does it matter? I like both options.

Now, taking the question from a different angle: "whether or not this type of thing would be even considered"...

The notion that our entire game spun off of some random occurrence in Wizard101 is pretty radical, but by no means would I dismiss it out of hand. Somebody on a forum (might have been KI Wizard, might have been Central) posted something to the effect of "I can't believe Blind Mew would be happy with the idea that his whole story happened because of something Wizards did."

Actually the idea fills me with glee. I helped plot that section out, and polished the dialogue. The notion of whether or not Wizard101 is the chicken to Pirate101's egg was fun, but more fun by far was letting Boochbeard's cluelessness run rampant again. Without Gandry, the Spiral may well have been lost. That makes me smile.

Remember: it's not the answer, friends, it's the discussion that matters. So speculate away.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 10, 2009
6079
Wonderful input Blind Mew. Your contributions are always packed full of wonderful. I was thoroughly delighted to know that you had a hand in writing that wonderful quest. I suspected but I didn't want to throw that into the mix unless I was sure. I had such a blast doing that quest and I am so looking forward to each one. The way it got us all thinking was superb and just shows what great writing can do to a community that loves to puzzle things out. Well played.

Lieutenant
Feb 20, 2010
184
Swordroll on Oct 8, 2014 wrote:
This evening, a bunch of fellow wizards and pirates and I were discussing the latest update in Wizard101. For those that don't know, the Maestro, an evil, time-tampering foe, decides to choose six critical points in the Spiral's history and try to change them for his benefit. One of the times he picks is before the beginning of the Pirate101 story. He captures Boochbeard and Gandry and hands them over to Deacon, who is not so trusting that [spoiler] the pirate Boochbeard and Gandry will rescue will one day defeat the Armada. Not wanting to take any chances, he keeps them anyway. However, our wizards appear and battle clockwork marines, including one elite marine, before suggesting that Boochbeard and Gandry go and save our pirate.

The whole Wizard vs. Pirate thing is pretty big. It's all in fun, of course, but we pose legitimate questions and ideas. The newest thing is that if it weren't for our wizards, our pirate would have never been rescued by Boochbeard and Gandry.

One theory is that they WOULD have, but the Maestro changed the past, so in our efforts to fix it, we bypassed that reality and instead have a new one (the same one we were in before), but we changed HOW we got there. Therefore, our wizards are indeed now responsible for our pirate journey (though not before the Maestro).

Another theory is that the Maestro's events and changes led to an alternate reality that leaves our wizards actually separated from our pirates, meaning they are NOT responsible for the rescue of our pirates.

"King Artorious" (a.k.a. Jesse Scoble) has been eyeing our conversation and supported the idea of a thread here. Perhaps Blind Mew will provide a little more insight as to whether this type of thing would even be considered, and whether or not the events in Wizard actually happened.

Let what is "real" be defined as what is contained within our current reality, and not an alternate reality. Should our pirates and wizards ever interact in the future, we will know that they are currently in the same reality, and thus proving the events to be real and our wizards to be responsible for the pirate rescue. But until then, can anyone provide insight on this? Is the past in which Boochbeard and Gandry discovered us by other means no more with our wizard having now had to bypass the Maestro's changes to time?
Hi there Swordroll! Thanks for stopping by this slice of the internet! I personally think that this is a interesting topic. My question is, how did the Armada learn magic?

Gunner's Mate
Dec 16, 2009
211
I do have a question for Blind Mew that is tangentially related to the storyline. How is it that Pirates such as Buster Crab and Armada were able to use wizard magic in combat? Did the maestro enhance their abilities temporarily?

Dread Pirate
Jun 13, 2011
1891
Eric Stormbringer on Oct 13, 2014 wrote:
I do have a question for Blind Mew that is tangentially related to the storyline. How is it that Pirates such as Buster Crab and Armada were able to use wizard magic in combat? Did the maestro enhance their abilities temporarily?
I think I may answer that one for him, because he is very usually busy and all.

In Wizard101, enemies use various magical spell cards to perform all sorts of magic in duels, such as creature summons to attack for them, increase their spells' powers, damage their opponents with traps, & all kinds of different spells to weaken them, make their spells fizzle, etc. The enemies seen in Pirate101 appear there in the Five B.O.X.E.S. Event, such as Buster Crab, haven't seen Wizards & use the fitting choice of spells in duels much often, mainly because they were so busy with so many piratical adventures, they often forget to bring spell cards & decks to duel the Wizards on occasions, should they meet each other from time to time, if they're not busy with their pirating days, that is. Plus, most Pirates really prefer to not get involved in the Wizards' affairs through several reasons, & the interaction of Wizards & Pirates rarely come often, for they have their own matters they tend to by themselves, though this doesn't stop them from mentioning them.

I really liked that event very much because it draws much references from Pirate101, especially the voices who did Deacon, Boochbeard, Mr. Gandry, & Buster Crab reprised their roles there!

The Maestro was in Skull Island to stop Wizards from creating the events that led up to the Pirates' adventures by keeping Boochbeard and Gandry out of their way and have the Armada confine them forever. Fortunately, the Wizards thwarted the Maestro's ploy by rescuing them, though it is clear the Clockworks would go on to capture orphaned Pirates so their plans won't be disrupted by them, thanks to taking the Maestro's advice to Deacon & the rest of the Clockworks, even Kane himself. After the rescue, Boochbeard and Gandry went on to free the Pirates so they can go on to have amazing adventures & defeat the Armada & much more, leading up to the beginning of Pirate101's events.

Maybe in time, we may have an Event in Pirate101 like Wizard101 does, with much references to Wizard101, especially the characters that appear in that game, once it is ready to support Events, someday. & I don't mean holiday events.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
5757
I finally saw a video on You Tube, that helped me understand what this is all about. I find the notion intriguing, that by interfering in history, the Maestro actually caused those events that he wished to prevent, occur!
If he hadn't meddled, Boochbeard and Gandry would have been completely clueless that an orphan pirate could bring down the Armada! Likewise, Deacon had no idea that a pirate orphan would bring down the Armada! By messing with the time line, the Maestro made it absolutely certain the events would occur!
* Mind Blown *
As to enemies in Skull Island using Wizard magic, its just the game's combat system. But if you want a 'story' explanation, try this: remember, we didn't actually fight Buster Crabb, Bonnie Anne called a parlay and he sent us after The Dutchman's Hook. What if Buster was actually a witchdoctor? As for the magic-wielding clockworks ( and that was really strange to me ), suppose that there was a program to create Wizard type clockworks, but Deacon saw how easily they were defeated by a true Wizard; he gave a report to Kane and the program was scrapped. Maybe this even explains why clockworks are so opposed to magic!

Admiral
Jul 27, 2012
1190
Yes, Esperanza, upon seeing Swordroll's topic and having been able to play that section in the BOXES event, I concur. It does indeed seem that the Maestro gave Boochbeard and Gandry the idea of searching for the orphaned young person that would take down the Armada. Meddling in time causing the very thing he doesn't want to happen, to happen! And I say, it serves him right!

But, it was wierd seeing Armada soldiers casting magic. Of course they needed to for the game system, but it felt more natural when the Marines would do their usual attack with their halberd in the circle against my wizard. (not that my wizard Isabella was particularly delighted to be clobbered so ) I really enjoyed the BOXES segments I was able to do (it came during a particularly tight schedule of time for me, but it was very clever and beautifully done). Naturally though, since I love Pirate, I enjoyed the Boochbeard and Gandry sequence the most.

Gunner's Mate
Dec 29, 2012
213
This thread is verifiable proof there has been an undeniable lack of Blind Mew's Musings lately. Let's not let this disease fester any longer.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 10, 2009
6079
Oran from Urz on Nov 13, 2014 wrote:
This thread is verifiable proof there has been an undeniable lack of Blind Mew's Musings lately. Let's not let this disease fester any longer.
I thought Blind Mew's wonderfully long responses were a delightful treat. He took time out of his insanely busy schedule to enlighten us once more. I am grateful for any glance at the light and am more that willing to be patient for when he has time to muse our way. Although when he finally has time to muse again, that will mean we will be busy in the new chapter.

Captain
Jun 26, 2010
586
Well Blind Mew, that be interesting and yet logical, hmm.

- Deadeye Jack Morgan

Gunner's Mate
Jul 08, 2013
263
Swordroll on Oct 8, 2014 wrote:
This evening, a bunch of fellow wizards and pirates and I were discussing the latest update in Wizard101. For those that don't know, the Maestro, an evil, time-tampering foe, decides to choose six critical points in the Spiral's history and try to change them for his benefit. One of the times he picks is before the beginning of the Pirate101 story. He captures Boochbeard and Gandry and hands them over to Deacon, who is not so trusting that [spoiler] the pirate Boochbeard and Gandry will rescue will one day defeat the Armada. Not wanting to take any chances, he keeps them anyway. However, our wizards appear and battle clockwork marines, including one elite marine, before suggesting that Boochbeard and Gandry go and save our pirate.

The whole Wizard vs. Pirate thing is pretty big. It's all in fun, of course, but we pose legitimate questions and ideas. The newest thing is that if it weren't for our wizards, our pirate would have never been rescued by Boochbeard and Gandry.

One theory is that they WOULD have, but the Maestro changed the past, so in our efforts to fix it, we bypassed that reality and instead have a new one (the same one we were in before), but we changed HOW we got there. Therefore, our wizards are indeed now responsible for our pirate journey (though not before the Maestro).

Another theory is that the Maestro's events and changes led to an alternate reality that leaves our wizards actually separated from our pirates, meaning they are NOT responsible for the rescue of our pirates.

"King Artorious" (a.k.a. Jesse Scoble) has been eyeing our conversation and supported the idea of a thread here. Perhaps Blind Mew will provide a little more insight as to whether this type of thing would even be considered, and whether or not the events in Wizard actually happened.

Let what is "real" be defined as what is contained within our current reality, and not an alternate reality. Should our pirates and wizards ever interact in the future, we will know that they are currently in the same reality, and thus proving the events to be real and our wizards to be responsible for the pirate rescue. But until then, can anyone provide insight on this? Is the past in which Boochbeard and Gandry discovered us by other means no more with our wizard having now had to bypass the Maestro's changes to time?
this is interesting this stuff just gives you a headache but if i may idk if this help but still this is a very good possibly i do remember making a post that i think that wizard101 is in our past maybe this maestro dude has something to do with it

Captain
May 16, 2011
553
anecorbie on Nov 8, 2014 wrote:
I finally saw a video on You Tube, that helped me understand what this is all about. I find the notion intriguing, that by interfering in history, the Maestro actually caused those events that he wished to prevent, occur!
If he hadn't meddled, Boochbeard and Gandry would have been completely clueless that an orphan pirate could bring down the Armada! Likewise, Deacon had no idea that a pirate orphan would bring down the Armada! By messing with the time line, the Maestro made it absolutely certain the events would occur!
* Mind Blown *
As to enemies in Skull Island using Wizard magic, its just the game's combat system. But if you want a 'story' explanation, try this: remember, we didn't actually fight Buster Crabb, Bonnie Anne called a parlay and he sent us after The Dutchman's Hook. What if Buster was actually a witchdoctor? As for the magic-wielding clockworks ( and that was really strange to me ), suppose that there was a program to create Wizard type clockworks, but Deacon saw how easily they were defeated by a true Wizard; he gave a report to Kane and the program was scrapped. Maybe this even explains why clockworks are so opposed to magic!
Correct! I like to think of this from the terms of "Angels Take Manhattan" from Doctor Who. In this episode, River Song experienced the events of that episode, then wrote about it later on in the future. The Doctor got his hands on a copy of the published book, which he read. Amy reads aloud later on, the comes across a line "The Doctor said, 'Because Amy read it in a book, and now I have no choice' " The point is then fixed. The Doctor was forced to say it to River because "Amy read it in a book." And so, this applies to the B.O.X. quest. Someone obviously told The Maestro about the events that transpire in Pirate101, and BAM, it's true. Even if The Master- actually, Mistress now- sorry, Maestro attempted to go back in time to change it,(which he did) there is nothing he could have done. If he had prevented Boochbeard and Gandry from ever freeing our pirates, The Maestro would have never heard about the events, causing a paradox. Unless he cannibalizes the B.O.X.,(that's another episode for another time) of course. So, ultimately, you're right, the reason our pirates are doing our pirating is because of The Maestro. Thanks, Maestro!

Although...... The reason the Armada know about us is because of The Maestro............................................................... Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...........

Lieutenant
Oct 12, 2012
145
Come on guys its so simple Boochbeard went to the oracle and they took so many years from him that he can barely remember anything they gave him a question with a question and he said "what" and got on his ship when he noticed Gaundry was not on the boat he was finding out details he could, don't you know all monquistians read minds? Tsk tsk its not always this happens, maybe we too need some remembering potions so our no man left behind thing works.

-Level 65 and Level 65
P.S. Good hunting Pie+rats=Pirates :P

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