Ranged Classes Reach the End of the Line in 1v1's

AuthorMessage
Ensign
Dec 05, 2009
13
There's been a lot of hype recently about new changes to PvP, some changes more obvious than others, but all affecting the power of the melee classes - So what does this all mean for ranged classes, who have not received such "balance" changes?

Well, first let us examine the changes to the melee classes, starting with the Swashbuckler. We all know about the new change to hidden, so no need to explain it - but what does this mean? For ranged classes fighting Swashbucklers, the old strategy was always to save an AoE to prevent getting your pirate and companions from getting decimated the next turn once the Black Fog comes out. But now what can the rangers do, BRACE FOR ONSLAUGHT! However there really is no shielding all of your companions - it's either you or one to two of them, guaranteed dead the next turn. So, in summary, the advantages that rangers held over swashbucklers are now nonexistent -Witches and Muskets cannot AoE to break a group hidden, and Musket traps are hardly effective against swashes, especially when the swash is coming to assassinate you the third turn, with three hidden companions by his or her side, that is. When hidden comes out, out goes your lights, rangers.

So now let us examine the buccaneer, the hidden powerhouse. At first glance, the buccaneer pirate may seem balanced, and actually the statement is not too far from the truth, which I cannot say for Swashbucklers. Okay, so what is the problem then? Let us instead take a look at the buccaneer companions and see. Buccaneer companions decimate those of the musket. Why? Because a charge in at top speed from across the map, plus a smash on accuracy is a farewell to musketeer companions, the former companion power houses. Witch companions? Right, those do not exist, pardon my ignorance. So, again, back to the question - what does this mean? It means that buccaneers can load up with strength buffs plus the one generously given by Peter Quint, and go in for the charge! With about 300% strength buffs, you can assure an affluent amount of relentlesses and criticals will soon follow. The Buccaneers you try to use - they'll just be outdone; the musketeers you use - They'll just be outclassed; the witches, oh wait, that's right, nevermind. This means that rangers cannot match the buffing up of their class companions and facing the Buccaneers, a truly one sided effort. So the new powerhound Peter Quint is ready to go, but Chantel is ready to get smashed, and Carcarius - wait nevermind. So, yes, Buccaneers are ready to power up and charge in with some buffed out powerhouse companions, sorry rangers, once the Buccaneers go in - you go out.

Now let us conclude, shall we. Ranged classes at this point, as far as fighting Swashbucklers and Buccaneers, have reached the end of the line. So, what can we do? Well, let's just sit back and hope the developers make a new "balance" change, this time for us rangers, but the odds do not look so good.

Corrupt Corwin Carter - Team EnVy

Captain
Feb 02, 2013
721
Doom Pirate on Sep 30, 2014 wrote:
There's been a lot of hype recently about new changes to PvP, some changes more obvious than others, but all affecting the power of the melee classes - So what does this all mean for ranged classes, who have not received such "balance" changes?

Well, first let us examine the changes to the melee classes, starting with the Swashbuckler. We all know about the new change to hidden, so no need to explain it - but what does this mean? For ranged classes fighting Swashbucklers, the old strategy was always to save an AoE to prevent getting your pirate and companions from getting decimated the next turn once the Black Fog comes out. But now what can the rangers do, BRACE FOR ONSLAUGHT! However there really is no shielding all of your companions - it's either you or one to two of them, guaranteed dead the next turn. So, in summary, the advantages that rangers held over swashbucklers are now nonexistent -Witches and Muskets cannot AoE to break a group hidden, and Musket traps are hardly effective against swashes, especially when the swash is coming to assassinate you the third turn, with three hidden companions by his or her side, that is. When hidden comes out, out goes your lights, rangers.

So now let us examine the buccaneer, the hidden powerhouse. At first glance, the buccaneer pirate may seem balanced, and actually the statement is not too far from the truth, which I cannot say for Swashbucklers. Okay, so what is the problem then? Let us instead take a look at the buccaneer companions and see. Buccaneer companions decimate those of the musket. Why? Because a charge in at top speed from across the map, plus a smash on accuracy is a farewell to musketeer companions, the former companion power houses. Witch companions? Right, those do not exist, pardon my ignorance. So, again, back to the question - what does this mean? It means that buccaneers can load up with strength buffs plus the one generously given by Peter Quint, and go in for the charge! With about 300% strength buffs, you can assure an affluent amount of relentlesses and criticals will soon follow. The Buccaneers you try to use - they'll just be outdone; the musketeers you use - They'll just be outclassed; the witches, oh wait, that's right, nevermind. This means that rangers cannot match the buffing up of their class companions and facing the Buccaneers, a truly one sided effort. So the new powerhound Peter Quint is ready to go, but Chantel is ready to get smashed, and Carcarius - wait nevermind. So, yes, Buccaneers are ready to power up and charge in with some buffed out powerhouse companions, sorry rangers, once the Buccaneers go in - you go out.

Now let us conclude, shall we. Ranged classes at this point, as far as fighting Swashbucklers and Buccaneers, have reached the end of the line. So, what can we do? Well, let's just sit back and hope the developers make a new "balance" change, this time for us rangers, but the odds do not look so good.

Corrupt Corwin Carter - Team EnVy
Id say your wrong, muskets are easily the most capable class to counter melee, chantals snipers, bombs, pretty easy, and if all you have is a witch id suggest spending less time on league and more time maxing classes capable of countering your problems(musket, swash, buck)

Gunner's Mate
Apr 19, 2012
292
Doom Pirate on Sep 30, 2014 wrote:
There's been a lot of hype recently about new changes to PvP, some changes more obvious than others, but all affecting the power of the melee classes - So what does this all mean for ranged classes, who have not received such "balance" changes?

Well, first let us examine the changes to the melee classes, starting with the Swashbuckler. We all know about the new change to hidden, so no need to explain it - but what does this mean? For ranged classes fighting Swashbucklers, the old strategy was always to save an AoE to prevent getting your pirate and companions from getting decimated the next turn once the Black Fog comes out. But now what can the rangers do, BRACE FOR ONSLAUGHT! However there really is no shielding all of your companions - it's either you or one to two of them, guaranteed dead the next turn. So, in summary, the advantages that rangers held over swashbucklers are now nonexistent -Witches and Muskets cannot AoE to break a group hidden, and Musket traps are hardly effective against swashes, especially when the swash is coming to assassinate you the third turn, with three hidden companions by his or her side, that is. When hidden comes out, out goes your lights, rangers.

So now let us examine the buccaneer, the hidden powerhouse. At first glance, the buccaneer pirate may seem balanced, and actually the statement is not too far from the truth, which I cannot say for Swashbucklers. Okay, so what is the problem then? Let us instead take a look at the buccaneer companions and see. Buccaneer companions decimate those of the musket. Why? Because a charge in at top speed from across the map, plus a smash on accuracy is a farewell to musketeer companions, the former companion power houses. Witch companions? Right, those do not exist, pardon my ignorance. So, again, back to the question - what does this mean? It means that buccaneers can load up with strength buffs plus the one generously given by Peter Quint, and go in for the charge! With about 300% strength buffs, you can assure an affluent amount of relentlesses and criticals will soon follow. The Buccaneers you try to use - they'll just be outdone; the musketeers you use - They'll just be outclassed; the witches, oh wait, that's right, nevermind. This means that rangers cannot match the buffing up of their class companions and facing the Buccaneers, a truly one sided effort. So the new powerhound Peter Quint is ready to go, but Chantel is ready to get smashed, and Carcarius - wait nevermind. So, yes, Buccaneers are ready to power up and charge in with some buffed out powerhouse companions, sorry rangers, once the Buccaneers go in - you go out.

Now let us conclude, shall we. Ranged classes at this point, as far as fighting Swashbucklers and Buccaneers, have reached the end of the line. So, what can we do? Well, let's just sit back and hope the developers make a new "balance" change, this time for us rangers, but the odds do not look so good.

Corrupt Corwin Carter - Team EnVy
I feel your pain. However, don't give up just yet. My Witchdoctor stomped a max Buccaneer the other day by hitting for over two thousand on a well timed Mojo Reaver. The 'rangers' should head to Moo Manchu and stock up on some tower gear if they're feeling left out. My Witchdoctor can carry a ridiculous amount of Jobu's Embrace, Mojo Storm and Mournsong now. Being able to deal damage and heal at the same time is quite a handy skill to have and I keep all of my Jobu's Embrace very near the top of my lineup. My Musketeer has enough bombs now to carpet all of Skull Island wall to wall as well as a healthy amount of Critical Strikes which now trigger Double Tap. Use some companions that have Hold The Line Rank 3 to halt charging Buccaneers and their companions and then break out your multi-target attacks. Save your armor shredding Mojo Reaver and Mojo Blades for the up close and personal parts of the battle and I think you'll do just fine. I have three max pirates and Swashbuckler is and always has been my favorite. I stuck with this class through the rough times and would now like to enjoy the good times. We all know how fleeting they can be. I guess my only advice for dealing with Swashbucklers would be...run away. Lol. Swashbucklers are not the indestructible beings you make them sound like. We have little or no armor. Your AOE attacks still cause us damage while we are hidden so if you can weather the storm of the first assault you should be able to hold your own with any Swashbuckler. I can't give away all my Musketeer tricks for dealing with Buccaneers and Swashbucklers, but having some shielding and healing of your own is a good place to start. Carry a hidden in your lineup too. I still use the Dragoon Autocannon for pvp and after using hidden, it can hit for over three thousand damage and as far as I know, that's enough to take out any Swashbuckler.

Ensign
Dec 05, 2009
13
zuto4011a on Oct 4, 2014 wrote:
Id say your wrong, muskets are easily the most capable class to counter melee, chantals snipers, bombs, pretty easy, and if all you have is a witch id suggest spending less time on league and more time maxing classes capable of countering your problems(musket, swash, buck)
I wouldn't put it that simply, I already mentioned the weaknesses of musketeer companions to buccaneers, and how traps aren't very effective against swashbucklers. When melees charge in fast, there isn't time for much zoning. I'm not suggesting any nerfs to melee classes, just improvements to ranged classes to help even out the new differences. Recent updates caused a huge gap in between the classes, and my suggestion was an attempt to bring attention to this. It shouldn't be so black and white as to have one class completely dominate another, but for each of them to have specific advantages over each other so that each class could at least give another one a run for its money as opposed to complete domination of some match ups as the game is now. A class should not have to resort to extremes just to have a chance at facing another (hiding in the back corner behind companions). I also don't believe that one should have to make a completely new character just to cope with the new updates, and personal attacks really are not the way to resolve problems.I would advise watching experienced players of different classes face off, and then you might notice the results are consistently the same the overwhelming majority of the time, as a result of new class changes.

Ensign
Dec 05, 2009
13
Spiral Cowboy on Oct 5, 2014 wrote:
I feel your pain. However, don't give up just yet. My Witchdoctor stomped a max Buccaneer the other day by hitting for over two thousand on a well timed Mojo Reaver. The 'rangers' should head to Moo Manchu and stock up on some tower gear if they're feeling left out. My Witchdoctor can carry a ridiculous amount of Jobu's Embrace, Mojo Storm and Mournsong now. Being able to deal damage and heal at the same time is quite a handy skill to have and I keep all of my Jobu's Embrace very near the top of my lineup. My Musketeer has enough bombs now to carpet all of Skull Island wall to wall as well as a healthy amount of Critical Strikes which now trigger Double Tap. Use some companions that have Hold The Line Rank 3 to halt charging Buccaneers and their companions and then break out your multi-target attacks. Save your armor shredding Mojo Reaver and Mojo Blades for the up close and personal parts of the battle and I think you'll do just fine. I have three max pirates and Swashbuckler is and always has been my favorite. I stuck with this class through the rough times and would now like to enjoy the good times. We all know how fleeting they can be. I guess my only advice for dealing with Swashbucklers would be...run away. Lol. Swashbucklers are not the indestructible beings you make them sound like. We have little or no armor. Your AOE attacks still cause us damage while we are hidden so if you can weather the storm of the first assault you should be able to hold your own with any Swashbuckler. I can't give away all my Musketeer tricks for dealing with Buccaneers and Swashbucklers, but having some shielding and healing of your own is a good place to start. Carry a hidden in your lineup too. I still use the Dragoon Autocannon for pvp and after using hidden, it can hit for over three thousand damage and as far as I know, that's enough to take out any Swashbuckler.
Some very valuable advice, good to know that people are innovating some new strategies to deal with these changes. I'll have to look into some of the things you said, as well as try to innovate some of my own strategies. Though I still wouldn't say that certain strategies completely, or reliably, neutralize imbalances, they are still a good place to start. I'll be investigating in the meantime.

Captain
Feb 02, 2013
721
Doom Pirate on Oct 6, 2014 wrote:
I wouldn't put it that simply, I already mentioned the weaknesses of musketeer companions to buccaneers, and how traps aren't very effective against swashbucklers. When melees charge in fast, there isn't time for much zoning. I'm not suggesting any nerfs to melee classes, just improvements to ranged classes to help even out the new differences. Recent updates caused a huge gap in between the classes, and my suggestion was an attempt to bring attention to this. It shouldn't be so black and white as to have one class completely dominate another, but for each of them to have specific advantages over each other so that each class could at least give another one a run for its money as opposed to complete domination of some match ups as the game is now. A class should not have to resort to extremes just to have a chance at facing another (hiding in the back corner behind companions). I also don't believe that one should have to make a completely new character just to cope with the new updates, and personal attacks really are not the way to resolve problems.I would advise watching experienced players of different classes face off, and then you might notice the results are consistently the same the overwhelming majority of the time, as a result of new class changes.
I do watch these "experienced" players but there really is no point in trying to change it right now, from ratbeards actions he's made it clear pvp is at the bottom of his list

Ensign
Dec 05, 2009
13
zuto4011a on Oct 10, 2014 wrote:
I do watch these "experienced" players but there really is no point in trying to change it right now, from ratbeards actions he's made it clear pvp is at the bottom of his list
As far as there being no point in trying to change it, I think that it should at least be made known to encourage change. This was the purpose of my post. Concerning your other point, about pvp being at the bottom of the to-do list, I completely agree. Though if enough protest is raised, developers would be forced to be a bit less tenacious about having everything their way. Hopefully they can understand that the way the it is now doesn't work, but we can all agree that this probably won't happen anytime soon.