Possible bug with Forbiddance power?

AuthorMessage
Lieutenant
Aug 29, 2008
145
So when I test realm first came out and I tested out Forbiddance, I noticed that it was only removing low level powers like Rouse, Triton's Song or Gunnery after multiple attempts at using it. Right away I told myself "well this is useless!"

Today I decided to test it out again after a comment by another player and to my surprise the above seems to have been fixed. I tested it using my Swashbuckler (with forbiddance) against my own Privateer. These were the results of all 5 trials:

Trial 1: Removed my Privy's copy of Scorpion Swarm
Trial 2: Removed both my Privy's and Swashbuckler's copies of Valor's Fortress
Trial 3: Removed my Privy's Zeal
Trial 4: Removed my Privy's Big Guns
Trial 5: Removed both my Privy's and Swashbuckler's copies of Valor's Fortress

It seems to have been fixed so that more higher level powers are randomly removed. This is great! All copies of the powers above were removed each time. So in the case of my Privateer, he lost all his 4 Fortress in one turn, just like that. I plan to run more trials, but figured I would post this as soon as possible to make KI aware in case that trials 2 and 5 were a bug.

As you can see from trials 2 and 5, not only did Forbiddance remove my target's Valor's Fortress, but also removed my own. This only happens when both you and your target have copies of the same power that is being removed from the game. Is this behavior intended? Is the caster also meant to lose his own copies of the power being removed? If so, why is this not indicated in the power card?

Hoping that it is a bug. Otherwise, not sure who would risk losing their own copies of important powers like Valor's Fortress.

Developer
Thanks so much for posting and giving me an opportunity to explain this power.

It's working as intended (and hasn't been changed, by the way-- you must have just been unlucky; typical RNG!)

The power searches the target's hand, but removes all copies of the power from his deck.

And then it removes all copies of that same power that you have in your own deck.

It will be most powerful against anything your opponent is likely to have a lot of (both because they are more likely to be in his hand, and because it will remove all of them); and it is (obviously) best used against opponents who are unlikely to have anything you yourself are using.

Unless of course you want to play defense, and hold a few of the target's powers in your hand in case he uses Forbiddance on you.

How will you defend against Forbiddance? Do you try not to draw your best powers into your hand early, in case a Forbiddance comes out? Or do you draw your best cards as early as possible and try to use them quickly before Forbiddance is played?

I think it's probably most powerful in a Witchdoctor's arsenal (as it should be: it's their trainer.)

And of course it's great if it targets anything exclusive to a class (*cough* Black Fog *cough*)

I'll admit it: I love this crazy Power.

I'm working to find a better way to message ALL of the details of the power, but I need to squeeze it into 3 lines of text.

Lieutenant
Aug 29, 2008
145
Ratbeard on Aug 3, 2015 wrote:
Thanks so much for posting and giving me an opportunity to explain this power.

It's working as intended (and hasn't been changed, by the way-- you must have just been unlucky; typical RNG!)

The power searches the target's hand, but removes all copies of the power from his deck.

And then it removes all copies of that same power that you have in your own deck.

It will be most powerful against anything your opponent is likely to have a lot of (both because they are more likely to be in his hand, and because it will remove all of them); and it is (obviously) best used against opponents who are unlikely to have anything you yourself are using.

Unless of course you want to play defense, and hold a few of the target's powers in your hand in case he uses Forbiddance on you.

How will you defend against Forbiddance? Do you try not to draw your best powers into your hand early, in case a Forbiddance comes out? Or do you draw your best cards as early as possible and try to use them quickly before Forbiddance is played?

I think it's probably most powerful in a Witchdoctor's arsenal (as it should be: it's their trainer.)

And of course it's great if it targets anything exclusive to a class (*cough* Black Fog *cough*)

I'll admit it: I love this crazy Power.

I'm working to find a better way to message ALL of the details of the power, but I need to squeeze it into 3 lines of text.
Thank you so much Ratbeard for such a detailed answer! I wasn't sure if what I was seeing was a bug or not, so figured I would post about it. Interesting to know that it is not a bug!

After running a.. lets just say few .. more trials, I did figure out that the power it removes has to be one in the opponent's hand. It is a power that I now plan to pick up on all 5 classes after seeing how it works.

At the very best, you get rid of an opponent's key power (Zeal, Walk in Darkness, Terror-Cotta Warriors, etc). At the very worse you get rid of both your opponent's and your own Fortress, Revives or even Assassins, which would make the duel very very interesting. Either way I see it, you come out on top if you plan it just right.

Interestingly enough, in one of my tests, my Swashbuckler removed my Privateers' own copy of Forbiddance. So if it becomes a frequently trained power, that would be the only scenario where I can see the power hurting you, since you waste a turn for almost nothing.

Not sure if it would work well to remove Fog, considering most Swashbucklers will use Fog when they are still way out of your range, but it would be deadly to get lucky and remove a Swashbuckler's Assassin's Strikes, Poisons or Walk in Darkness.

Very interesting power. Love it, and good luck explaining all the details of it!

Dread Pirate
Jun 13, 2011
1973
Ratbeard on Aug 3, 2015 wrote:
Thanks so much for posting and giving me an opportunity to explain this power.

It's working as intended (and hasn't been changed, by the way-- you must have just been unlucky; typical RNG!)

The power searches the target's hand, but removes all copies of the power from his deck.

And then it removes all copies of that same power that you have in your own deck.

It will be most powerful against anything your opponent is likely to have a lot of (both because they are more likely to be in his hand, and because it will remove all of them); and it is (obviously) best used against opponents who are unlikely to have anything you yourself are using.

Unless of course you want to play defense, and hold a few of the target's powers in your hand in case he uses Forbiddance on you.

How will you defend against Forbiddance? Do you try not to draw your best powers into your hand early, in case a Forbiddance comes out? Or do you draw your best cards as early as possible and try to use them quickly before Forbiddance is played?

I think it's probably most powerful in a Witchdoctor's arsenal (as it should be: it's their trainer.)

And of course it's great if it targets anything exclusive to a class (*cough* Black Fog *cough*)

I'll admit it: I love this crazy Power.

I'm working to find a better way to message ALL of the details of the power, but I need to squeeze it into 3 lines of text.
That... and a new "PVP ONLY" label instead of it being text. Just suggesting.

Developer
Here's the update:

One random power from target's hand removed from both players' decks

Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
826
well now this seems a little op, i have all my forts below my first 2 bars yet regularly draw 4 in the first 2 rounds. this seems like it will be worse then fog

Lieutenant
Nov 21, 2010
103
Right now Forbiddance can only target opposite players, is that a bug? Why not target opponent's companions or even pets?

Developer
Duncan StormThief on Aug 3, 2015 wrote:
Right now Forbiddance can only target opposite players, is that a bug? Why not target opponent's companions or even pets?
It only works on players.