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What Swashbucklers Need

AuthorMessage
Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.

Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
826
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
After fighting you a few times i can identify where you fail as a buckler, you typically play right into my hand by either fogging first turn and being forced to fight contessa or you charge me with no shields, the problem lies with your gear, and how you play, you'll need 2-3 forts, possibly an absorb, more hides and more assassins, and purge, just the fact that you have purge on adds a lot of pressure, i gave you those knives to help you get started the rest is up to you to get and learn how to use, with your current gear i'm not pressured at all, if i survive your initial assault i cant die

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
zuto4011a on Nov 13, 2017 wrote:
After fighting you a few times i can identify where you fail as a buckler, you typically play right into my hand by either fogging first turn and being forced to fight contessa or you charge me with no shields, the problem lies with your gear, and how you play, you'll need 2-3 forts, possibly an absorb, more hides and more assassins, and purge, just the fact that you have purge on adds a lot of pressure, i gave you those knives to help you get started the rest is up to you to get and learn how to use, with your current gear i'm not pressured at all, if i survive your initial assault i cant die
Yeah, yeah, Robert. I'm at least trying to meet your strategy ( and if we're going to criticize methods ) you're turning into a one trick pony - even when you fought as a buck; you jammed yourself in one corner and buffed/shield stacked to the sky.
How is anyone to face that? So I've got to load myself down with farmed gear, ignore the fact that even if I do, your buffed and shielded companions will always be superior to mine.
Bucklers need a trained critical buff for their team now that VA2 has shown that Fog isn't effective any more. I would prefer to have a way to shield my companions also.
You've got to recognize one of our talents is seriously bugged - Jump hasn't worked properly since the Ranked PVP patch.
Also, Assassin's Strike can't be stacked, not even with Backstab ( so I lose on the damage from my attacks ).
A fix to how Black Fog works might be in order or having a new "Hide" for bucklers would be good.
BTW in one of our matches I changed gear, I had Bishop's Sprocket Key, but that stupid Purge never showed up. Now I have to depend on a power that may or may not show?
I thank you for the Knives, but without a way to enhance my damage I might as well be using toothpicks

Ensign
Sep 03, 2010
13
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
No swashbucklers don't really rule the PvP arena but at the same time.. we don't need anything more to benefit our class. Yes Black Fog not showing up can be a pain but even if it does, by the way you're talking you use it first round which gives your opponent 2-3 rounds to prepare and counter, so yes you are basically playing into their hands. Ultimately what I think your post should say is, "Hey I'm having trouble as a swashbuckler, can someone give me some tips?" If you want some tips, start with your gear.. Most swashbucklers run 3 forts(Hat/Boots/Eyepatch) and either revive outfit and charm, or revive outfit and purge. The best weapon to use for a buckler currently is the Spring Champions weapon. This alone gives you 2-3 heals in your gear, ignoring pet grants and talents. Also you are going to find exponential problems without elusive 3 so make sure you get a hold of that. The rest of the gear(totem and ring) should be the from the tower, giving you your extra 2 assassins, poison and hide. Start with these things and then come back and ask for some companion tips, strategy tips and all that jazz instead of instantly saying swashbucklers need to be buffed.. because we don't.

Petty Officer
Jan 03, 2010
95
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
"I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings."

Please speak for yourself, as a swashbuckler main I've had little trouble in ranked no matter who or what class I vs. I'm sure this is partly due to my experience as a pvp player, though without the right gear I'd be struggling too.

Regarding your comments of Black Fog, any top swashbuckler can win without utilizing Black Fog to it's fullest potential (hiding their entire team). Yes it's a more difficult fight, but it's nowhere near the realm of unwinnable. You just have to learn to improvise since you can't always count on things going your way. Instead of saying things need to be fixed just because you're having trouble, perhaps you could try asking for help?

The only point I somewhat agree with you on is lack of team buffs, our only real ones lying in Toro and Fan. I definitely see room for improvement for the class in that regard, though imo it's still unreasonable to say it's a necessity.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
zuto4011a on Nov 13, 2017 wrote:
After fighting you a few times i can identify where you fail as a buckler, you typically play right into my hand by either fogging first turn and being forced to fight contessa or you charge me with no shields, the problem lies with your gear, and how you play, you'll need 2-3 forts, possibly an absorb, more hides and more assassins, and purge, just the fact that you have purge on adds a lot of pressure, i gave you those knives to help you get started the rest is up to you to get and learn how to use, with your current gear i'm not pressured at all, if i survive your initial assault i cant die
Okay, on second thoughts, I shifted through the detritus of all my characters and found this set-up "submitted to your approval":
Gladiator's Galea ( Empire Bundle )
Level 60
+8 agility
+10 accuracy
+6 dodge
+6 magic resist
+11 armor
Grants: Revive
Gladiator's Outfit ( Empire Bundle )
Level 60
+9 ag.
+6 acc.
+6 dodge
+12 magic res.
23 base armor
Grants: Flanking ( a curse to bucklers, imo )
Cattle Baron's Boots
level 35
+5 weapon power
Grants: Valor's Armor
This still doesn't help my companions in any way. I still maintain bucklers need a critical boost for companions. Something trained and not a drop.
I do have the Sprocket Key, but it's only one use and I have to depend on it showing up at the right time; this, imo, isn't skill - it's luck.
Dante pointed out to me that you frequently imposed the rule: "no discord" ( of course, that power is the perfect answer to a someone using your strategy. )
P.S. I apologize for calling you a one trick pony.

Captain
Jun 10, 2013
717
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
I actually see some logic in your post but I do think Black Fog needs to be changed so Blast Of Discord works while it is on. Of course a pet with Scent 2 already counters Black Fog.

Community Leader
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
  • I don't see why jumping over barricades matter. 90% of the time, barricade gets positioned between the opposing team and the wall, giving you no places to jump to (even if you could). That other 10%, you're probably facing some that's either unskilled that randomly places it (you should win), or you positioned a companion in a way that forces them to place it in a different place (meaning you have a lot of pressure on them, and should win).
  • Black fog is nowhere near necessary to win. I've seen plenty of people pull off wins without it.
  • There is no protection in the game that doesn't have some sort of drawback. Forts are temporary and you can be targeted with anything. Leviathans are vulnerable to magic and have the same 'clause' as a fort. Kraken leaves you vulnerable to all non-melee attacks. Valor's shield and triton's song are only 25% and triton protects against melee alone. Absorbs are vulnerable to hidden targets, but protect from bladestorms as long as they stay up. Barricades can be killed and they force one companion to be completely vulnerable (or they force resources to be spent protecting that companion). Knockback bombs can be timed out and leave you open to ranged hits. Hold the line units or summons are bypassed by hidden and (in the case of summons) are easily chained down or aoe'ed. Yes, some classes get more protections than others, but the classes that lack protection receive compensation in offensive capability. It's a give and take.
  • You're not a privy, buckler companions are meant to be there for you to get max value out of them before they die. Cloud spirit, the shadowdance line, and espirit, are more than enough to make your team lethal for enough time to trade effectively. Don't waste protects on them and try and get them to the late game.

Continued in next post...

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Community Leader
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
Continued from previous post
  • A buckler with a somewhat ideal pet and full gear can get the following shields: 3 Valor's fortresses (or 2 forts and an absorb), 1 Valor's shield (trained), 1 Triton's song and/or Kraken's Lament (pet grants for both or trained in the case of Triton). Not to mention that same setup gets you the following heals: 1-2 revives (depends on whether or not you run purge), 1 rally (pet), 1 rouse (trained, possibly a second from a pet). Once one gets spring champion, add on the spring heal. That leaves you in total with 3-4 'large' protects (forts/absorbs and a Kraken), 1-3 small protects (1-2 Triton's and a Valor's shield) and 3-5 heals (dependent on if you run purge or not and whether or not you have a champ weapon). Couple that with 3 assassins minimum, 4 poisons (1x shroud, 2x gloom, 1x mist), and 4 hides (fog, walk in darkness x2, walk in shadows), and you should have more than enough offense and defense to be able to win. As Rob said, Purge is also super helpful. It can negate one or more of an opponent's shields, or it can be used as an one hit combo in the early game.

I'm guessing a lot of your complaints are stemming from the fact you are attempting to use a stat-based setup. Stat. Based. Setups. Don't. Work. For. Buckler. In. Ranked. Period. End of Discussion. Sure they can win occasionally, but a good player can stall out the minimal protects you have and dominate the late game. Get a full gear set, get a decent pet (relentless, rally, elusive at minimum) and then try again. It'll be much easier to compete with a full gear set. Finally, no one claims that buckler dominates the arena currently. If someone says that, they're flat out wrong. However, they are far from the worst, and are more than competitive.

Writer and PvP enthusiast at FinalBastion

Check us out for all things Pirate101 and Wizard101 PvE/PvP

Gunner's Mate
Dec 25, 2015
285
anecorbie on Nov 12, 2017 wrote:
I'm probably going to ignite a firestorm of protest by this post; but I don't care.
I've just had a frustrating morning dealing with the over the top defenses of other classes in Ranked PVP.
1. A barricade that I can't Jump over, never mind that Jump is one of my Talents. I've been complaining about this Talent being bugged for 2 and a half years, it needs to be fixed ASAP! I can't even Jump over barricades in PVE ( friendly or non-friendly, I can no longer Jump over them, when I used to be able to do so. )
2. The utterly frustrating fact that unless Black Fog shows up by the second round, I'm usually defeated. I need a better defense that doesn't have a "clause" ( you can still hit me with AOEs ).
3. I need to be able to buff my companions, they need the chance to get criticals. All that's available for SB is Fan's Agility buff or El Toro's Esprit. Meanwhile other classes get buffs that enhance their companions abilities for a certain amount of rounds.
4. Shielding ( enough said ).
Now go ahead and TELL me that bucklers rule the PVP Arena - I'll tell you that you're oblivious to our short comings.
Buckler doesn't rule the arena, they are middle tier. Number one is correct that should be fixed, however the other 3 make it seem like you want to be a privy with massive dodge massive damage hides and poisons. buckler doesn't need a a bunch of shields or buffs, buck doesn't get fog or charm and they are not complaining, so why is buckler?

Sorry if that came off as a bit rude.

Community Leader
anecorbie on Nov 13, 2017 wrote:
Okay, on second thoughts, I shifted through the detritus of all my characters and found this set-up "submitted to your approval":
Gladiator's Galea ( Empire Bundle )
Level 60
+8 agility
+10 accuracy
+6 dodge
+6 magic resist
+11 armor
Grants: Revive
Gladiator's Outfit ( Empire Bundle )
Level 60
+9 ag.
+6 acc.
+6 dodge
+12 magic res.
23 base armor
Grants: Flanking ( a curse to bucklers, imo )
Cattle Baron's Boots
level 35
+5 weapon power
Grants: Valor's Armor
This still doesn't help my companions in any way. I still maintain bucklers need a critical boost for companions. Something trained and not a drop.
I do have the Sprocket Key, but it's only one use and I have to depend on it showing up at the right time; this, imo, isn't skill - it's luck.
Dante pointed out to me that you frequently imposed the rule: "no discord" ( of course, that power is the perfect answer to a someone using your strategy. )
P.S. I apologize for calling you a one trick pony.
Drop the outfit. Switch it for Friar Sand's revive robe or a bazaar revive robe. I assume you're using a fort eyepatch? You won't last without at least one and since you're not using a fort hat and you're using absorb boots you need it there. Assuming you're using purge and the moo totem and ring, your gear set is acceptable. If you're not using purge just throw on another revive in that slot.

Writer and PvP enthusiast at FinalBastion

Check us out for all things Pirate101 and Wizard101 PvE/PvP

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
RRRRZZZZ419 on Nov 13, 2017 wrote:
I actually see some logic in your post but I do think Black Fog needs to be changed so Blast Of Discord works while it is on. Of course a pet with Scent 2 already counters Black Fog.
Black Fog is no defense to Blast of Discord; the only defense is to keep from grouping together. And so many other talents can remove hides that a scent pet is redundant.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
Everyone's comments are kindly meant, so I've taken them in the spirit they were offered.
However, regardless of how Barricade is used in PVP; there still remains the problem that one of my Talents is no longer working properly.
I'm not asking for gear advice but for help for my team. I don't want to be treading into Privy territory, but having some ( even just one other ) ability to enhance my companion's attacks would be helpful. Shadow Dance is a personal buff and does nothing for my team. My companions are woefully out-gunned by many class's buffs/debuffs.
And Matthew, my stats have got me through some tight squeezes - I will NOT sacrifice beyond a certain point.

Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
826
anecorbie on Nov 13, 2017 wrote:
Yeah, yeah, Robert. I'm at least trying to meet your strategy ( and if we're going to criticize methods ) you're turning into a one trick pony - even when you fought as a buck; you jammed yourself in one corner and buffed/shield stacked to the sky.
How is anyone to face that? So I've got to load myself down with farmed gear, ignore the fact that even if I do, your buffed and shielded companions will always be superior to mine.
Bucklers need a trained critical buff for their team now that VA2 has shown that Fog isn't effective any more. I would prefer to have a way to shield my companions also.
You've got to recognize one of our talents is seriously bugged - Jump hasn't worked properly since the Ranked PVP patch.
Also, Assassin's Strike can't be stacked, not even with Backstab ( so I lose on the damage from my attacks ).
A fix to how Black Fog works might be in order or having a new "Hide" for bucklers would be good.
BTW in one of our matches I changed gear, I had Bishop's Sprocket Key, but that stupid Purge never showed up. Now I have to depend on a power that may or may not show?
I thank you for the Knives, but without a way to enhance my damage I might as well be using toothpicks
i seem like a one trick pony because i dont actually try vs people unable to overcome something as simple as sitting in a corner, in fact i daresay the only time i dont use a brain dead strategy is when fighting Reckless Christopher, i cant watch youtube and play witcher 3 at the same time when fighting him like i can the majority of players. Yes you do have to wear farmed gear, and yes my companions will be superior if you let me buff them round after round, and to be quite frank jump not working wouldnt matter at all vs me seeing as i dont have barricades. Again the problem lies with you not understanding what gear to use and how to effectively use your team and pirate, you need more practice but before that you need the gear, 2 forts(boots, eyepatch) absorb hat, purge, tower totem and ring, and revive robe, along with either spring champ weapon or boarding knives. As for your discord comment, i didnt think i needed to publicly state that seeing as you are a swashbuckler and i am a privateer that rule is for your benefit and not mine, as is my no boon, scratch, and no summons from gear rules.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
Everything that you're suggesting has one major problem: it would reduce my Dodge to unacceptable levels and for what? A power that may or may not show exactly when I need it? ( And only a single use? )
I'm telling you that my Dodge not only enables me to avoid Talent attacks but also is essential to gaining riposte strings combined with Relentless & Bladestorm ( from pet ). This has actually given me what wins I have.
And as to Jump being unnecessary, don't you think that this talent may be useful if team Ranked PVP comes to the game? It's not only myself being affected by this glitch but also companions with this talent.
Black Fog is my only way of buffing my companions, yet I'm told that I'm "only to get max value out of them before they die" therefore to get "max value" I must Fog and even then, they don't give "max value" because of buff/shield stacking.
I am so heartily sick of farming - you don't think I've farmed? For this past year I've done nothing but farm!
I have Asclepious' eyepatch, it's not worth equipping.
I have 2 ranks in Elusive.
My pet is an excellent pet, suitable for a buckler ( I'm currently training another with hopefully better grants. )
The fact that all you can suggest is to load myself with gear is direct proof of my contention that bucklers need a way to buff their companions.
And Robert, I'm trying to get practice, but you're not helping when you use a "brain dead strategy" for me.
It takes time to cross the Spar Room arena, by the time I get there you're in your corner and sitting back buffing and shielding.
I suppose I could hide behind one of the pillars and wait out those buffs & shields. I could also wait out those bombs and traps but then I and my team will be sitting ducks for anyone else.

Community Leader
For starters, a scent pet is nowhere near redundant. It is still by far the most effective way to remove a hide. Now, moving on to the stats vs powers debate. Yes, stats may have saved you in some instances. But for every time your stats save you, there's going to be a different occasion that not having powers fails. Or, there will be occasions where your stats fail you. I've faced bucklers and bucks using stat-based setups. They generally require sacrificing 1-2 protects, 1-2 heals, and/or 1-2 attacks in exchange for better stats. Now what happens when a conventional setup times out or destroys your protects, neutralizes your heals, and survives most of your hits? (This can very easily happen) The conventional setup is left with much more firepower and defenses to close out the match. You, the stat based player, are out of firepower and defenses.
These are the glaring problem with stat based setups that you have to be willing to deal with
They rely on getting much of their damage through chains and rely on getting chained on less (since they have more dodge). This means that you're relying on RNG for a chunk of your offense and defense. RNG is incredibly fickle, and when it fails you once, it's game over.They are generally more vulnerable to ranged and magical attacks. What I mean is, a stat based setup can easily trade blows with a buck, buckler, and in some cases privy. What happens when a witch or a musket has blocked your path to them (through htl summons/units, bombs, barricade, etc) and are hitting you with buffed mournsongs, aoes, sniper shots, and trick shots? Your stats aren't getting you out of that one. And since you have fewer protects or heals, you can't survive the onslaught as long as a normal setup can.
In conclusion, stats may be helpful, but I can promise you that a conventional setup is far superior when learning buckler pvp. Prioritize getting your heals and protects maxed out first. Then and only then, get stats as high as you can. Cont...

Writer and PvP enthusiast at FinalBastion

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Community Leader
Continued from previous...
Once you get a good feel for the class, then you can pick up a stat based setup. I've seen them work before. (I'm of the opinion, however, that they are generally inferior to normal setups outside of a couple matchups) I get it, farming gear is a pain. You're not a new player though, so I can't imagine that you have none of the pieces. You said you already had Sprocket's Key. That's the hardest thing to farm in a buckler setup. I assume you've ran moo enough to have at least one of the buckler rings and totems. Level doesn't matter (we're talking about a difference of 4 weapon power). You say you have a Valor's armor gear piece. That leaves 3 pieces left to farm. You can get the Valor's Fortress Hat (Tantojutsu headband) from Friar Sand. Valor's Fortress Eyepatch comes from Sssiva in Aquila. Revive Robe comes from Friar Sand, but if you really don't want to farm that, get a Bazaar Revive robe. If you want to get a third fort on your boots rather than an absorb, Friar Sand drops a pair (or Shoes of Faunus from various Aquila bosses). We all had to spend time farming for good gear. It's not fun, but it's worth it ultimately. Don't expect to get equally good results if you shortcut gear.

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Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
Matthew525011 on Nov 14, 2017 wrote:
Continued from previous...
Once you get a good feel for the class, then you can pick up a stat based setup. I've seen them work before. (I'm of the opinion, however, that they are generally inferior to normal setups outside of a couple matchups) I get it, farming gear is a pain. You're not a new player though, so I can't imagine that you have none of the pieces. You said you already had Sprocket's Key. That's the hardest thing to farm in a buckler setup. I assume you've ran moo enough to have at least one of the buckler rings and totems. Level doesn't matter (we're talking about a difference of 4 weapon power). You say you have a Valor's armor gear piece. That leaves 3 pieces left to farm. You can get the Valor's Fortress Hat (Tantojutsu headband) from Friar Sand. Valor's Fortress Eyepatch comes from Sssiva in Aquila. Revive Robe comes from Friar Sand, but if you really don't want to farm that, get a Bazaar Revive robe. If you want to get a third fort on your boots rather than an absorb, Friar Sand drops a pair (or Shoes of Faunus from various Aquila bosses). We all had to spend time farming for good gear. It's not fun, but it's worth it ultimately. Don't expect to get equally good results if you shortcut gear.
Thank you for your input, Matthew and for taking the time to post - yes, I have most of the gear you've mentioned ( not the headband; that has never dropped for me & I've farmed Sand for a very long time )
Shoes of Faunus ( which I got from Scavengin', believe it or not ) & Aesclipious Eyepatch. I'm still very reluctant to drop my Dodge stat further than it is, seeing as when I used Faunus, extra hides, assassins and heals from moo tower and a Vicious Charge hat ( for that oh so useful debuff ) and also Purge. When I got this gear ( after the first season of Ranked PVP ), my win loss record wasn't any better than now.
( Except for that first season of Ranked PVP, when I actually got to Hero before facing the Moo Robe spammers, then I became a Gladiator. )
It seems to me that my problem is my companions.

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
Matthew525011 on Nov 14, 2017 wrote:
Continued from previous...
Once you get a good feel for the class, then you can pick up a stat based setup. I've seen them work before. (I'm of the opinion, however, that they are generally inferior to normal setups outside of a couple matchups) I get it, farming gear is a pain. You're not a new player though, so I can't imagine that you have none of the pieces. You said you already had Sprocket's Key. That's the hardest thing to farm in a buckler setup. I assume you've ran moo enough to have at least one of the buckler rings and totems. Level doesn't matter (we're talking about a difference of 4 weapon power). You say you have a Valor's armor gear piece. That leaves 3 pieces left to farm. You can get the Valor's Fortress Hat (Tantojutsu headband) from Friar Sand. Valor's Fortress Eyepatch comes from Sssiva in Aquila. Revive Robe comes from Friar Sand, but if you really don't want to farm that, get a Bazaar Revive robe. If you want to get a third fort on your boots rather than an absorb, Friar Sand drops a pair (or Shoes of Faunus from various Aquila bosses). We all had to spend time farming for good gear. It's not fun, but it's worth it ultimately. Don't expect to get equally good results if you shortcut gear.
Why does everyone need to be set-up the same? I seem to remember Robert ( zuto4011a ) posting about wanting more "diversity".
Why can't players try something different? You might even see that you don't need every single piece of gear you have equipped.

Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
826
anecorbie on Nov 14, 2017 wrote:
Everything that you're suggesting has one major problem: it would reduce my Dodge to unacceptable levels and for what? A power that may or may not show exactly when I need it? ( And only a single use? )
I'm telling you that my Dodge not only enables me to avoid Talent attacks but also is essential to gaining riposte strings combined with Relentless & Bladestorm ( from pet ). This has actually given me what wins I have.
And as to Jump being unnecessary, don't you think that this talent may be useful if team Ranked PVP comes to the game? It's not only myself being affected by this glitch but also companions with this talent.
Black Fog is my only way of buffing my companions, yet I'm told that I'm "only to get max value out of them before they die" therefore to get "max value" I must Fog and even then, they don't give "max value" because of buff/shield stacking.
I am so heartily sick of farming - you don't think I've farmed? For this past year I've done nothing but farm!
I have Asclepious' eyepatch, it's not worth equipping.
I have 2 ranks in Elusive.
My pet is an excellent pet, suitable for a buckler ( I'm currently training another with hopefully better grants. )
The fact that all you can suggest is to load myself with gear is direct proof of my contention that bucklers need a way to buff their companions.
And Robert, I'm trying to get practice, but you're not helping when you use a "brain dead strategy" for me.
It takes time to cross the Spar Room arena, by the time I get there you're in your corner and sitting back buffing and shielding.
I suppose I could hide behind one of the pillars and wait out those buffs & shields. I could also wait out those bombs and traps but then I and my team will be sitting ducks for anyone else.
I have suggested getting gear and LEARNING TO USE IT, beating my brain dead strategy is the first step, if you cant beat that you really don't wanna fight an actual strategy, you know who I'm using how i use them and even the order of powers I use, think of how to counter it, and yes you should wait all that out because charging a privateer with zeal, discipline, forts, and gallant defense is dumb. Forget your dodge you'll naturally have enough you dont need 200+ from gear because guess what, with my 2 assassins alone I can kill you as is if I'm in tide thats not even counting soul shroud or crits because you lack heals and forts, a swashbucklers companions are tools they are not the main attack like with privateer, just use them to kill troublesome companions like muskets and forget them, melee companions will miss you if you wear the gear I said to you don't even have to be in elusive unless they have tide 2 and call to arms. The problem is not the class the problem is you are unwilling to acknowledge that your dodge set up is inferior to a power set up

Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
826
anecorbie on Nov 15, 2017 wrote:
Why does everyone need to be set-up the same? I seem to remember Robert ( zuto4011a ) posting about wanting more "diversity".
Why can't players try something different? You might even see that you don't need every single piece of gear you have equipped.
i want more diversity because everyone is pigeonholed into running near the same thing for the best results, if you are fine never being your best then your current set up is fine

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
zuto4011a on Nov 16, 2017 wrote:
i want more diversity because everyone is pigeonholed into running near the same thing for the best results, if you are fine never being your best then your current set up is fine
This is tragic, it allows no creativity or innovation and beyond the core players, PVP is going to die off. Ok, I'll try it your way but my dodge ( after sacrifices, and I did sacrifice a lot for that current set-up ) is going to be less than 180. To me this not enough to counter the talent attacks of my opponents.
"Hello, Friar Sand, remember me?"

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
9777
zuto4011a on Nov 16, 2017 wrote:
i want more diversity because everyone is pigeonholed into running near the same thing for the best results, if you are fine never being your best then your current set up is fine
Ok, I'm listening ( & following ) everyone's advice. Here's what I now have as a PVP set:
Currently farming for the Head band from Friar Sand.
Wu Gong Robe that grants Revive
Shoes of Faunus that grants Valor's Fortress ( and a nice bit of dodge, which makes me happy ).
Asclepius' Talisman ( eyepatch ) grants Valor's Fortress ( or should I equip Technomage glasses for Dispel Magic? )
Sprocket Key grants Purge Magic
As for totem & ring I found these in the bazaar:
Ornament of Sumuru grants Revive
Black Pearl Annulet grants Super Strike.
My Pet grants me:
Triton's Song, Regroup, Relentless, Bladestorm and an extra 2 ranks of Dodge.
I'm currently training up a couple pets that seem promising with more grants.
P.S. These make a horribly ugly combination of clothes; my artistic sense is outraged - must visit Eloise!

Ensign
Sep 03, 2010
13
anecorbie on Nov 15, 2017 wrote:
Thank you for your input, Matthew and for taking the time to post - yes, I have most of the gear you've mentioned ( not the headband; that has never dropped for me & I've farmed Sand for a very long time )
Shoes of Faunus ( which I got from Scavengin', believe it or not ) & Aesclipious Eyepatch. I'm still very reluctant to drop my Dodge stat further than it is, seeing as when I used Faunus, extra hides, assassins and heals from moo tower and a Vicious Charge hat ( for that oh so useful debuff ) and also Purge. When I got this gear ( after the first season of Ranked PVP ), my win loss record wasn't any better than now.
( Except for that first season of Ranked PVP, when I actually got to Hero before facing the Moo Robe spammers, then I became a Gladiator. )
It seems to me that my problem is my companions.
I'll go ahead and put it bluntly, it seems to basically everyone replying to you right now that the problem DOESNT stem from your companions, but from how YOU play, YOUR lack of actual practice and willingness to improve.. there comes a point where you need to stop pointing fingers at the lack of buffs, the lack of this the lack of that and look in the mirror and see where the problem may actually be. If you want me be an unconventional swashbuckler than so be it but you will not get to champion rank like that, you will lose more often than win. All the champions you see around the Spar Chamber, swashbucklers especially, all have power-granting gear. This is because it works, we don't complain about our lack of buffs because we don't need them, like I've stated before.. it ultimately comes down to your lack of skill when it comes to PvP.

Community Leader
anecorbie on Nov 16, 2017 wrote:
Ok, I'm listening ( & following ) everyone's advice. Here's what I now have as a PVP set:
Currently farming for the Head band from Friar Sand.
Wu Gong Robe that grants Revive
Shoes of Faunus that grants Valor's Fortress ( and a nice bit of dodge, which makes me happy ).
Asclepius' Talisman ( eyepatch ) grants Valor's Fortress ( or should I equip Technomage glasses for Dispel Magic? )
Sprocket Key grants Purge Magic
As for totem & ring I found these in the bazaar:
Ornament of Sumuru grants Revive
Black Pearl Annulet grants Super Strike.
My Pet grants me:
Triton's Song, Regroup, Relentless, Bladestorm and an extra 2 ranks of Dodge.
I'm currently training up a couple pets that seem promising with more grants.
P.S. These make a horribly ugly combination of clothes; my artistic sense is outraged - must visit Eloise!
Headband is good. Robe is good, if you happen to get the revive robe from Sand before you get the hat, use that for the large agility buff. Boots are good. Use Asclepius Talisman. Dispel magic isn't that helpful for buckler imo. Sprocket Key is good, but I'd also have a revive charm from the Bazaar on hand if you would ever want to sub purge out. I would STRONGLY recommend using the Moo Manchu totem and ring. From those two you gain 2 assassin's strikes and an extra 5 round hide and 5 round poison. (You also get +16-20 weapon power depending on whether they are the level 55, 60, or 65 version). To put it simply, you need the extra firepower from the assassins and poison as well as the damage buff / protection of the hide. I can't recall a match against a skilled opponent where I only used 1 assassin. I seem to recall that you've said you've farmed moo quite a bit, so I can't imagine that you don't have at least one of the two. They drop quite frequently from the 4 lock chests on floor 4 and 8 of the tower, so the farming shouldn't be too bad if you don't have them. Pet is ok. Triton is a severely underrated talent imo. Relentless is great, Bladestorm is a nice addition. Since bucklers train dodgy 3 by default, grants dodgy 2 is useless to us (I just checked it with a grants dodgy pet on my character, there's no effect). There are 3 things are quintessential for buckler (and buccaneer) pets. They should be prioritized in this order, in my opinion:
  1. Grants Elusive (This boosts our dodge at < 50% health to 240 with the standard setup. Compare that with 200 if one only has elusive 2. There's a huge difference, especially vs buccaneers that have tide 3+ and a Wu Tang buff)
  2. Grants Rally (The buckler that can heal spam is the most annoying buckler. Consider replacing purge with a revive charm if you lack Rally)
  3. Grants Relentless (It's more than possible to survive without this. It's a big help, a game changer, and should be a goal, but it's not a completely necessity.

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