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Napoleguin's Next Move and The Armada's New Goals

AuthorMessage
Gunner's Mate
Feb 26, 2013
245
Hello! I'd like to start this off by saying this is all speculation and almost exclusively generating questions for discussion, and I'd really love to hear what you guys think. Thanks for reading :)

Something that I think has been overlooked so far is the impact the freed Napoleguin can have on the rest of the Spiral. More specifically, the impact he could have on the Armada. The whole reason that the Clockwork Armada was made was to take down Napoleguin and end the Polarian War. But the problem is, Napoleguin has escaped.

So when will they do something about it? How much of their efforts will be put towards re-capturing the most dangerous mind in the Spiral? How will this change their attitude? Will they take a step back and throw away their menacing demeanor, or will they grow even more sinister? WILL they even do anything? It's obvious they've gained sentience, or at the very least the ability to seem sentient (and therefore a million times scarier).

And how will all this play into the Armada's downfall?

Previously I thought that the war on Marleybone would be what divided the Armada's efforts enough to aide in their downfall. Obviously the war with Marleybone has had a noticeable effect on the Armada (and Marleybone). Marleybone has perhaps the greatest navy in the spiral, rivaled only by the Armada themselves. During the war, thousands of Armada supplies were wasted when Beachhead was destroyed. Rooke's entire fleet was decimated by Admiral Nelson. Heck, Rooke HIMSELF was decimated by us.

But the thing about all of this is that everything has been done by the Armada's own free will.

The only reason they even have free will is because they fulfilled their purpose. But technically, they have now failed. Will their original programming take over and will their efforts all be concentrated into taking down Napoleguin? Will we team up with Napoleguin to destroy the Armada once and for all? Will there be a massive showdown between Polaris and Valencia?

I believe Blind Mew once said that we would take down the Armada before we reached El Dorado. So perhaps the last world before El Dorado will be either Polaris or Valencia, where we destroy the Armada once and for all?

Again, I'm honestly just spitballing here. Thanks for reading and I hope you have a fantastic week!

Cpt. Cruel Owen Quarrel, Level 65 Celestial Nomad

Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2010
114
Cruel Owen Quarrel on Oct 20, 2015 wrote:
Hello! I'd like to start this off by saying this is all speculation and almost exclusively generating questions for discussion, and I'd really love to hear what you guys think. Thanks for reading :)

Something that I think has been overlooked so far is the impact the freed Napoleguin can have on the rest of the Spiral. More specifically, the impact he could have on the Armada. The whole reason that the Clockwork Armada was made was to take down Napoleguin and end the Polarian War. But the problem is, Napoleguin has escaped.

So when will they do something about it? How much of their efforts will be put towards re-capturing the most dangerous mind in the Spiral? How will this change their attitude? Will they take a step back and throw away their menacing demeanor, or will they grow even more sinister? WILL they even do anything? It's obvious they've gained sentience, or at the very least the ability to seem sentient (and therefore a million times scarier).

And how will all this play into the Armada's downfall?

Previously I thought that the war on Marleybone would be what divided the Armada's efforts enough to aide in their downfall. Obviously the war with Marleybone has had a noticeable effect on the Armada (and Marleybone). Marleybone has perhaps the greatest navy in the spiral, rivaled only by the Armada themselves. During the war, thousands of Armada supplies were wasted when Beachhead was destroyed. Rooke's entire fleet was decimated by Admiral Nelson. Heck, Rooke HIMSELF was decimated by us.

But the thing about all of this is that everything has been done by the Armada's own free will.

The only reason they even have free will is because they fulfilled their purpose. But technically, they have now failed. Will their original programming take over and will their efforts all be concentrated into taking down Napoleguin? Will we team up with Napoleguin to destroy the Armada once and for all? Will there be a massive showdown between Polaris and Valencia?

I believe Blind Mew once said that we would take down the Armada before we reached El Dorado. So perhaps the last world before El Dorado will be either Polaris or Valencia, where we destroy the Armada once and for all?

Again, I'm honestly just spitballing here. Thanks for reading and I hope you have a fantastic week!

Cpt. Cruel Owen Quarrel, Level 65 Celestial Nomad
It's an interesting idea. But there's a problem with it. According to Avery, after the end of the war (and therefore after Napoleguins capture), Valencia made a LOT more clockworks. I'm pretty sure, that clockworks made after his capture, wouldn't have this same programming. In fact, members of Kane's court were made later also. I doubt they have the same programming. Could this cause a split in the Armada? Between Kane (first of the clockworks) along with some of his court, plus the earlier infantry, trying to recapture Napoleguin, vs other elites, plus their own infantry (which would include newer models, i.e: Battle Angels and Dragoons), trying to find El Dorado? It's entirely possible, and in a fight, well I don't care how "Faster, stronger, and smarter than any, 'living thing'" he is, he will not win, and don't forget, if that's the case, then Kane will tear up the spiral trying to find him. We don't know where Napoleguin is, remember? He just sort of...disappeared.
Thanks for the post, it would never have occurred to me.

The Grin Reaper

Ensign
May 23, 2014
46
Cruel Owen Quarrel on Oct 20, 2015 wrote:
Hello! I'd like to start this off by saying this is all speculation and almost exclusively generating questions for discussion, and I'd really love to hear what you guys think. Thanks for reading :)

Something that I think has been overlooked so far is the impact the freed Napoleguin can have on the rest of the Spiral. More specifically, the impact he could have on the Armada. The whole reason that the Clockwork Armada was made was to take down Napoleguin and end the Polarian War. But the problem is, Napoleguin has escaped.

So when will they do something about it? How much of their efforts will be put towards re-capturing the most dangerous mind in the Spiral? How will this change their attitude? Will they take a step back and throw away their menacing demeanor, or will they grow even more sinister? WILL they even do anything? It's obvious they've gained sentience, or at the very least the ability to seem sentient (and therefore a million times scarier).

And how will all this play into the Armada's downfall?

Previously I thought that the war on Marleybone would be what divided the Armada's efforts enough to aide in their downfall. Obviously the war with Marleybone has had a noticeable effect on the Armada (and Marleybone). Marleybone has perhaps the greatest navy in the spiral, rivaled only by the Armada themselves. During the war, thousands of Armada supplies were wasted when Beachhead was destroyed. Rooke's entire fleet was decimated by Admiral Nelson. Heck, Rooke HIMSELF was decimated by us.

But the thing about all of this is that everything has been done by the Armada's own free will.

The only reason they even have free will is because they fulfilled their purpose. But technically, they have now failed. Will their original programming take over and will their efforts all be concentrated into taking down Napoleguin? Will we team up with Napoleguin to destroy the Armada once and for all? Will there be a massive showdown between Polaris and Valencia?

I believe Blind Mew once said that we would take down the Armada before we reached El Dorado. So perhaps the last world before El Dorado will be either Polaris or Valencia, where we destroy the Armada once and for all?

Again, I'm honestly just spitballing here. Thanks for reading and I hope you have a fantastic week!

Cpt. Cruel Owen Quarrel, Level 65 Celestial Nomad
Very true! Their first triumph has been undone (by us, of course. Who else?)! That hadn't clicked in my mind until now.

The Pirate story is very cool, because it works on so many levels-not only are we rescuing Napoleguin, we are defeating the Armada at their original purpose... Foreshadowing their downfall perhaps? Or foreshadowing that their original purpose (reestablish peace) is no longer a priority for them, nor is being controlled by Valencia? Both metaphors work....

Question: Did Blind Mew ever say that we would for sure shut down the Armada before we reached El Dorado? I'm positive he said we'd meet/fight all the elites by the time the El Dorado arc was concluded, but I think he specified that we would not have killed all the elites, which to me sounds like the Armada will still be a thing when we reach El Dorado. If I'm overlooking something, please prove me wrong, but I don't believe he DID say they'd be completely gone...

Have a fantastic week as well!

Lieutenant
May 26, 2013
145
Now that they have a snarky penguin emporor on the loose, they'll totally be destroyed

Gunner's Mate
Feb 26, 2013
245
Kan The Destroyer on Oct 21, 2015 wrote:
Very true! Their first triumph has been undone (by us, of course. Who else?)! That hadn't clicked in my mind until now.

The Pirate story is very cool, because it works on so many levels-not only are we rescuing Napoleguin, we are defeating the Armada at their original purpose... Foreshadowing their downfall perhaps? Or foreshadowing that their original purpose (reestablish peace) is no longer a priority for them, nor is being controlled by Valencia? Both metaphors work....

Question: Did Blind Mew ever say that we would for sure shut down the Armada before we reached El Dorado? I'm positive he said we'd meet/fight all the elites by the time the El Dorado arc was concluded, but I think he specified that we would not have killed all the elites, which to me sounds like the Armada will still be a thing when we reach El Dorado. If I'm overlooking something, please prove me wrong, but I don't believe he DID say they'd be completely gone...

Have a fantastic week as well!
THAT'S what he said! Ah! I couldn't remember exactly what he said, but I knew it was along those lines. Yes, I saw we'd fight every Elite by that time. I guess I mistook that for everyone would be dead. Honestly when I first read it I hadn't encountered Rooke or Bishop yet in a fight so I had thought that after you defeat an Elite in a fight they automatically die.

Huh. I don't know why I hadn't corrected myself since then.

The things I love most about the Pirate Story are:

a) All the amazing stuff we have accomplished (like seriously just put everything we've done into perspective for a moment and think about how many times we've done the impossible)

b) The wonderful, exciting, diverse characters that we've met during our adventures

and

c) MARLEYBONE. JUST MARLEYBONE.

Gunner's Mate
Feb 26, 2013
245
The Grin Reaper on Oct 20, 2015 wrote:
It's an interesting idea. But there's a problem with it. According to Avery, after the end of the war (and therefore after Napoleguins capture), Valencia made a LOT more clockworks. I'm pretty sure, that clockworks made after his capture, wouldn't have this same programming. In fact, members of Kane's court were made later also. I doubt they have the same programming. Could this cause a split in the Armada? Between Kane (first of the clockworks) along with some of his court, plus the earlier infantry, trying to recapture Napoleguin, vs other elites, plus their own infantry (which would include newer models, i.e: Battle Angels and Dragoons), trying to find El Dorado? It's entirely possible, and in a fight, well I don't care how "Faster, stronger, and smarter than any, 'living thing'" he is, he will not win, and don't forget, if that's the case, then Kane will tear up the spiral trying to find him. We don't know where Napoleguin is, remember? He just sort of...disappeared.
Thanks for the post, it would never have occurred to me.

The Grin Reaper
An Armada rebellion would be so, SO interesting. However, Kane is the be all end all of the Armada. All of the Elites compete with each other specifically to win Kane's favor.

On the OTHER hand, there has never been anything to divide the pre-defeat Armada (the Armada Clockworks made before Napoleguin's defeat) and the post-defeat Armada (Clockworks made after Napoleguin's defeat). Judging by design, I would say Phule and Deacon are the eldest elites, besides Kane. And, well, Deacon's out of the picture now. Rooke, Bishop, and possibly the Queen are the newer ones, Rooke seeming the most advanced and by extension newest.

Again, just spitballin'. Thank you for your insightful comment!

Admiral
Jul 27, 2012
1196
You bring up some very interesting points, Owen. It certainly is an intriguing consideration that if Kane has free will because 'he fulfilled his original programming', then could Napoleguin's return cause a reversion to the presumably original orders to take Napoleguin down?

However, I am not convinced that programming as such has anything to do with Kane. Looking at the Puppet show, and making inferences from that (which may not be correct, but that is the information we have right now), it seems that regular Armada soldiers may have been made first -- automata far more versatile than even the cleverest real life 18th-19th C. ones (and surviving ones do give an idea just how innovative and clever those toys for the fabulously wealthy were) but still essentially automata-- then the highly sophisticated Kane created; Kane, 'First of the Armada' and designed to be the Armada's general with a full range of intelligence and choice.

So Kane is different, more than an automaton - possibly very different, possibly possessing something of a 'life', no longer truly machine. I would venture to say this would be true for Kane's Elites too.

Now, considering the very interesting question of Napoleguin, what can we expect from him? Likely he will try to regain his power as emperor of Polaris. Only, how is this to be achieved? What is happening in Polaris now?

KI has given this question more weight by their fascinating sneak peek into Polaris for Wizard101. It seems that our wizard will enter a Polaris governed by a Walrus empress, with probably a Polarian version of the "Three Estates" characteristic of France before the 1789 Revolution (here we are looking at walruses, polar bears, and penguins). Now, did our wizard travel back in time, before the Polarian War? Or did Polaris revert back to their old ways once Napoleguin was deposed? Is this, then, roughly contemporary to our pirate, and Napoleguin has not yet arrived on the scene?

And of course, will Kane choose to interfere?

Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2010
114
Cruel Owen Quarrel on Oct 23, 2015 wrote:
An Armada rebellion would be so, SO interesting. However, Kane is the be all end all of the Armada. All of the Elites compete with each other specifically to win Kane's favor.

On the OTHER hand, there has never been anything to divide the pre-defeat Armada (the Armada Clockworks made before Napoleguin's defeat) and the post-defeat Armada (Clockworks made after Napoleguin's defeat). Judging by design, I would say Phule and Deacon are the eldest elites, besides Kane. And, well, Deacon's out of the picture now. Rooke, Bishop, and possibly the Queen are the newer ones, Rooke seeming the most advanced and by extension newest.

Again, just spitballin'. Thank you for your insightful comment!
So it would be Phule and Kane, v.s Bishop and Queen (don't forget that Rooke's out of the picture.) Interesting. You know, it occurs to me. Remember what Phules most recognizable traits are? His split personality, and his unpredictability. You, just CANNOT, expect a robot with two distinct personalities, to be completely compatible, with its programming, (I might have contradicted myself there, please let me know)! That being said, how would he react to something like this? It's possible one of his personalities might want to side with Kane, and the other might want to side with Queen. Now here's a stretch: what if Phule, becomes a pirate? According to the official lore of Pirate101, pirates were basically formed in the polarian war, as a group of people, who would switch sides, depending on where the winds of fortune were blowing, but eventually just broke off into their own groups. Isn't it at all likely, that to compromise between his personalities, as well as his programming, he would end up fighting both for, and against, each side? Either that, or he'll just go insane. One of the two.
(P.S, you're welcome)

The Grin Reaper

Pirate Overlord
Mar 16, 2012
10631
Anne Radcliffe on Oct 24, 2015 wrote:
You bring up some very interesting points, Owen. It certainly is an intriguing consideration that if Kane has free will because 'he fulfilled his original programming', then could Napoleguin's return cause a reversion to the presumably original orders to take Napoleguin down?

However, I am not convinced that programming as such has anything to do with Kane. Looking at the Puppet show, and making inferences from that (which may not be correct, but that is the information we have right now), it seems that regular Armada soldiers may have been made first -- automata far more versatile than even the cleverest real life 18th-19th C. ones (and surviving ones do give an idea just how innovative and clever those toys for the fabulously wealthy were) but still essentially automata-- then the highly sophisticated Kane created; Kane, 'First of the Armada' and designed to be the Armada's general with a full range of intelligence and choice.

So Kane is different, more than an automaton - possibly very different, possibly possessing something of a 'life', no longer truly machine. I would venture to say this would be true for Kane's Elites too.

Now, considering the very interesting question of Napoleguin, what can we expect from him? Likely he will try to regain his power as emperor of Polaris. Only, how is this to be achieved? What is happening in Polaris now?

KI has given this question more weight by their fascinating sneak peek into Polaris for Wizard101. It seems that our wizard will enter a Polaris governed by a Walrus empress, with probably a Polarian version of the "Three Estates" characteristic of France before the 1789 Revolution (here we are looking at walruses, polar bears, and penguins). Now, did our wizard travel back in time, before the Polarian War? Or did Polaris revert back to their old ways once Napoleguin was deposed? Is this, then, roughly contemporary to our pirate, and Napoleguin has not yet arrived on the scene?

And of course, will Kane choose to interfere?
I suspect that Polaris has reverted to the old days of the tsars ( remember that, historically, Great Britain restored the Bourbon regime when they first imprisoned Napoleon on Elba. ) I don't believe Kane will interfere unless it somehow impinges on the war with Marleybone. After all, how could Napoleguin wish to ally himself with MB or would MB even consider an alliance with Napoleguin?

Gunner's Mate
Feb 26, 2013
245
The Grin Reaper on Oct 24, 2015 wrote:
So it would be Phule and Kane, v.s Bishop and Queen (don't forget that Rooke's out of the picture.) Interesting. You know, it occurs to me. Remember what Phules most recognizable traits are? His split personality, and his unpredictability. You, just CANNOT, expect a robot with two distinct personalities, to be completely compatible, with its programming, (I might have contradicted myself there, please let me know)! That being said, how would he react to something like this? It's possible one of his personalities might want to side with Kane, and the other might want to side with Queen. Now here's a stretch: what if Phule, becomes a pirate? According to the official lore of Pirate101, pirates were basically formed in the polarian war, as a group of people, who would switch sides, depending on where the winds of fortune were blowing, but eventually just broke off into their own groups. Isn't it at all likely, that to compromise between his personalities, as well as his programming, he would end up fighting both for, and against, each side? Either that, or he'll just go insane. One of the two.
(P.S, you're welcome)

The Grin Reaper
Indeed, Phule is so utterly unpredictable that I have no clue where he could end up! The idea of Phule ending up as a separate entity, away from his title of an Armada Elite and taking up the occupation of a Pirate Lord is incredibly thrilling. His happy side seems very carefree (not to be mistaken with foolish) and his darker side seems to be calculating and menacing. As a Wild Card who enjoys watching the Elites bicker and squabble, here is my prediction for a way Phule could end up on his own as a Pirate:

Phule had long grown bored of how excellent things were going for the Armada, so when we created the perfect opportunity (or chaos) for Phule to get his kicks, he pounces. In the case of an Armada rebellion in which both sides are divided, Phule would come out on top. Not because he is the victor, but because he will be the survivor. As evidenced by the little dialogue we have with him, Phule knows almost everything. He knows who his enemies are, he knows what they are doing, and above all, he knows the perfect time to make a tactical retreat. Kane, the supreme clockwork, could easily contend against Bishop and the Queen on his own. Phule would be largely irrelevant to the whole rebellion. Instead, the joker would branch off and start his own group, similar to pirates, but not quite. He's smart enough to make it on his own. When he does this however would be unknown.

Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2010
114
Cruel Owen Quarrel on Oct 26, 2015 wrote:
Indeed, Phule is so utterly unpredictable that I have no clue where he could end up! The idea of Phule ending up as a separate entity, away from his title of an Armada Elite and taking up the occupation of a Pirate Lord is incredibly thrilling. His happy side seems very carefree (not to be mistaken with foolish) and his darker side seems to be calculating and menacing. As a Wild Card who enjoys watching the Elites bicker and squabble, here is my prediction for a way Phule could end up on his own as a Pirate:

Phule had long grown bored of how excellent things were going for the Armada, so when we created the perfect opportunity (or chaos) for Phule to get his kicks, he pounces. In the case of an Armada rebellion in which both sides are divided, Phule would come out on top. Not because he is the victor, but because he will be the survivor. As evidenced by the little dialogue we have with him, Phule knows almost everything. He knows who his enemies are, he knows what they are doing, and above all, he knows the perfect time to make a tactical retreat. Kane, the supreme clockwork, could easily contend against Bishop and the Queen on his own. Phule would be largely irrelevant to the whole rebellion. Instead, the joker would branch off and start his own group, similar to pirates, but not quite. He's smart enough to make it on his own. When he does this however would be unknown.
So I have a few things to say. First of all, thank you for the compliments, you make me swell with pride. Second of all, something annoying about this kind of post is that things keep..."just" occurring to me. Saying that, it can be summed up in this analogy: I'll be taking my ideas, loading into a sparkthrower, and not so much seeing which one will stick, but which one will blow the head off a Dragoon. So, it had "just" occurred to me that there are theories about Kane building some elites. Couldn't he make more? It would only make sense, I don't think I have to spell out why. A bigger question though, both of us forgot something. Do you really think that each, individual, mid-polarian war clockwork was programmed that way? of course not. If that were the case, you would have thousands of Armada ships, in effect kamakazying wherever Napoleguin happened to be, including Kane himself. Collectively the Armada are programmed that way. However, the infantry are simply programmed to follow Kanes command, Kane himself is programmed to find a way to take down Napoleguin, through strategy. That may even be how the elites are programmed ( to follow Kanes orders), with the obvious exception of Phule of course, (cause you know what he's like), which would knock my original theory out, and DARN IT! Did I really just disprove my own theory!? Sad times, truly sad times. on the plus side, with the entire armada,(except for Phule) focused on Napolaguin, this would give us an advantage in the race for El Dorado, although there is the possibility of him being imprisoned in Monquista, whick means the Armada would attack Monquista, so...not a good thing.The funny thing is, we are more alike to Phule than any other elite. We're both the wildcard, both survivors. Most likely to see eye to eye.

Like I said, just seeing which ideas will blow off the head of a Dragoon.
See y'all.

The Grin Reaper

Gunner's Mate
Feb 26, 2013
245
Anne Radcliffe on Oct 24, 2015 wrote:
You bring up some very interesting points, Owen. It certainly is an intriguing consideration that if Kane has free will because 'he fulfilled his original programming', then could Napoleguin's return cause a reversion to the presumably original orders to take Napoleguin down?

However, I am not convinced that programming as such has anything to do with Kane. Looking at the Puppet show, and making inferences from that (which may not be correct, but that is the information we have right now), it seems that regular Armada soldiers may have been made first -- automata far more versatile than even the cleverest real life 18th-19th C. ones (and surviving ones do give an idea just how innovative and clever those toys for the fabulously wealthy were) but still essentially automata-- then the highly sophisticated Kane created; Kane, 'First of the Armada' and designed to be the Armada's general with a full range of intelligence and choice.

So Kane is different, more than an automaton - possibly very different, possibly possessing something of a 'life', no longer truly machine. I would venture to say this would be true for Kane's Elites too.

Now, considering the very interesting question of Napoleguin, what can we expect from him? Likely he will try to regain his power as emperor of Polaris. Only, how is this to be achieved? What is happening in Polaris now?

KI has given this question more weight by their fascinating sneak peek into Polaris for Wizard101. It seems that our wizard will enter a Polaris governed by a Walrus empress, with probably a Polarian version of the "Three Estates" characteristic of France before the 1789 Revolution (here we are looking at walruses, polar bears, and penguins). Now, did our wizard travel back in time, before the Polarian War? Or did Polaris revert back to their old ways once Napoleguin was deposed? Is this, then, roughly contemporary to our pirate, and Napoleguin has not yet arrived on the scene?

And of course, will Kane choose to interfere?
The idea that Kane has ascended to a higher plane of understanding and knowledge and is no longer a machine is a very interesting idea. It's been played with in essentially every piece of media that involves high-functioning robots. The idea of a 'robot uprising' or machines gaining self-awareness is always fun to think about. But I feel as though the Clockworks are.. different.

The idea of programming itself is weird, because these are not traditional machines or robots. These are beautifully designed clockwork men and women with no imperfections, who are made to look like gods or goddesses in order to intimidate their enemies. They move with grace, and their voices emulate authority and superiority. Just listen to Rooke's voice. Honestly I could listen to Rooke all day.

I apologize. This message is turning a bit into an "Armada appreciation" post :p

It's very obvious that Kane wants El Dorado, but we still have not found out what for yet. It's speculated he wants all that gold to rebuild the Spiral with no place for pirates, but has that actually been confirmed? To us pirates, the Armada are obviously the bad guys, the evil ones, the ones standing in our way and trying to take our pirate treasure. But what are they to the rest of the Spiral? It's obvious that the people of Valencia have varying opinions on them. Keep in mind we've only seen one part of the Skyway. The people of Sivella seem to have wizened up to the Armada's sinister nature, but the Armada also protects merchant ships, which would make them seem benevolent. What in Avery's name does Kane want with El Dorado? And how will that interfere with his original mission (perhaps not programming) to capture Napoleguin? It's very strange indeed, and if there ever was a more perfect time for a Wizzy-Pirates crossover, it's now.

Lieutenant
Feb 14, 2014
184
I honestly feel as though there is some deeper knowledge of Kane that we don't know about. This also goes along with Queen/Lady Elite. Due to the fact that neither Kane nor Queen have been physically present in our storyline so far, they must be brewing up a storm in Valencia. Or maybe those two are the storms? There has to be some incredible plot twist involving the two.

On another note, I find Phules split personality quite...unrealistic. He is a clock work after all. How could he have personality? Let alone a split one? This could also lead to Kane and (possibly) Queen not being clockworks? Could Kane's, Phule's, (possibly) Queen's blue prints be tampered with? (Hoodoo to attain personality/emotion?)

You never know...