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Witchdoctor Epics

1
AuthorMessage
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Ratbeard, any thought on giving witches mojo echo 2 or mojo rising 2 yet? I had mentioned this before in test, and after doing more matches, I am watching my team get hit with chains of epics from the opposing pirate (follow through, relentless, bladestorm, etc), and this is after using power cards like assassin strike. For witches, of course, our relatively speaking ever-weaker spells dont trigger epics, so it would be good to at least have the option of having a more effective wand attack.
Developer
You'll notice that the stuff on the hidden trainers is not stuff that you get via your regular trainer-- which is the case with both ME2 and MR2. Both of those talents are slated to unlock in your normal training path.

I am not sure what would happen if I put a supposed-to-be-free talent on the hidden trainer, but I am pretty sure the answer is, "Game and/or players get confused."

I am sympathetic to your request but the only short-term solution would be to put bonus ranks of those talents on pets or items.

Is PvP impossible for you now, or is this more of a sense of, "That's cool and we should have it, too."

Left out, or left behind?
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
PVP is not impossible, but thats largely because of my summoned scorpions and warriors. I would imagine that its even harder for witchdoctors without them, because for me, once an opponent has an open path to me, I often die within a turn or two, even if I have some type of shield. Except for mojo reaver, its seems like the damage that we can deal with spells is often not enough to make an impact, especially at close range. Of course the rare super spell can do a thousand damage (mojo storm, mournsong), but melee classes can easily do more than that with a non-critical assassin + blade storm + follow through + etc...

I think that providing those epics on pets would be a great idea for now. At least then we could hope to get lucky with a string on wand attacks.
Lieutenant
Aug 29, 2008
146
Considering the Swashbuckler Apex Shark has Grant First Strike (a talent Swashbucklers get the rank 3 of for free), I wouldn't mind seeing the Witchdoctor Apex Shark have Grant Mojo Echo.

Is not even a talent that Witchdoctors can use freely. Unlike melee units with Relentless, Witch's powers won't trigger the Mojo Echo. So adding Mojo Echo would add some diversity because now the Witch has to decide "do I risk a basic attack for the chance of Mojo Echo or do I guarantee my Mojo Storm/Mournsong hit?" Is the same situation Musketeers are in with Burst Fire 2 (from trainer and pet).
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
For witches, it would be useful to have mojo echo 2 or 3 as an option, especially at close range and when the opponent as a fort. With a fort, a mornsoung or mojo storm would likely do around 250 damage, which is not much. Wand attacks with a chain of echos could do more damage than that, so it would be comparable to the damage that melee classes can inflict on opponents who have a fort.
Lieutenant
May 09, 2013
157
I'm actually against giving WDs more epics before another increased level cap. As a Buccaneer, I have the advantage of tons of epics, but on the other hand, I only start with eleven powers. Witch doctors on the other hand have over thirty powers. Even the weaker ones such as the eyeball attacks are scary to me because they are a guaranteed magic hit, so charges and bucc shields are ineffective against it. I think I like where bucc vs WD stands and if mojo echo 2 existed now, I feel like all buccs would be forced to invest in witch hunter.
Ensign
Mar 18, 2015
35
If we are going around changing the Epics on the Apex Sharks, would it be possible to remove Grants Blade Storm from the Privateer Shark and replace it with a more suitable Grant Talent? All the other Apex Sharks receive new Grants never before seen prior to this update, and I feel it would not be appropriate to leave the Privateer Shark out.
Lieutenant
Oct 11, 2012
108
I wouldn't mind having another mojo echo. Sure, Witchdoctor has over 30 powers @bluba4, but have you thought on how effective they are? I don't know any Witchdoctor that uses Ghost Wail (i.e. Widows Touch, Vulture's Gift, Evil Eye) at level 65, but maybe I am speaking to the wrong people. Charm is banned from PvP (If you PvP) because it isn't working properly (I think), so you can cross that one off too.

If giving Witchdoctors more epics unbalances the game, maybe they could have more dodge options? This would give them a better footing against melee users, like Swashbucklers. As a Swashbuckler I wouldn't mind this, but I don't think Buccaneers would be happy with this option. It would possible shutdown their chain of attacks. Witchdoctor isn't meant to have a lot of dodge, so this is just an option 'to consider'.

Making it trainable I don't think should be implemented into the game. I think items should grant it, there is already an item that grants burst fire. It would change the whole format of the game if it were to be changed, so I really hope its not made trainable until a storyline update.
Lieutenant
Nov 26, 2010
163
bluba4 on Aug 7, 2015 wrote:
I'm actually against giving WDs more epics before another increased level cap. As a Buccaneer, I have the advantage of tons of epics, but on the other hand, I only start with eleven powers. Witch doctors on the other hand have over thirty powers. Even the weaker ones such as the eyeball attacks are scary to me because they are a guaranteed magic hit, so charges and bucc shields are ineffective against it. I think I like where bucc vs WD stands and if mojo echo 2 existed now, I feel like all buccs would be forced to invest in witch hunter.
Why don't you train into Witch Hunter? It makes Witches think twice before hitting you with that reaver and its just an extra hit. Vs the Staff on Privy's it makes it so they can't deal damage to you with basic wand attacks. IMO it already is a MUST or at least a why not...

Giving them Mojo Echo 2 isn't anything IMO because it doesn't trigger from powers like Relentless/Burst fire do so whats so bad about it? If they want to normal attack you with there wand that's amazing because if you have Witch Hunter you just cancelled there damage and got off an amazing chain....
Ensign
May 23, 2015
33
I have been very active PVPing my witchdoctor and have played enough games now to give an honest opinion. The only class I have yet to beat is a loaded Buccaneer. The only reason is no direct line of sight from the beginning. They can travel the entire board and come straight to me. By the time I can knock down a few barrels they have buffed with valor so high I can't do any damage. The only effective spell we have to counter this is widows touch. You don't even have time to apply mournsong, soulreaver, or ghostwail which is effective with other classes. Teleporting away does not help as he is back on you the next round. Your only hope is having strong enough companions to try and get to him before his charge. Swashbuckers are hard but doable. I don't really see why they need so much movement. PVE does not require that in any map I have been on. This is my only gripe the rest can be dealt with. Although witchdoctors may be improved upon with an additional two slots of spells to choose from as we are highly dependent on our arsenal for survival. When the right spells don't come up in the first two rounds we are toast. I think they should be in order you specify period but that is another story. My health is over 3000 and if a buccaneer can one shot me then there is something wrong there with no possible hope of escape other than hidden. Our highest damage output is our sword which I have yet to ever see a super critical so the best we can hope for is a mere 1000 or so damage negating armor and valor. I am open to suggestions on how to overcome this barrier. Thanks
Ensign
Oct 25, 2012
9
I think that Witchdoctor should not only get more epics, but also have their epics count for spell attacks. Currently Witchdoctor's epics only have a chance to activate from a wand attack. IMO, Witchdoctor should focus on getting spell power, because Witchdoctors get many spells. Also, they do not get much weapon power. Epics would be much more useful if it initiated because of a spell. In certain cases, such as Mournsong, an infinite range attack, they might be out of range. In this case Mojo Echo would not be able to reach the target, a resolution might be that the Mojo Echo just has no chance to cast. Only would Mojo Echo have a chance at casting after an infinite range attack if the target was in range. Therefore I think that Witchdoctor should not only get more epics, but also have their epics count for spell attacks. Thanks for taking the time to read my post!
Lieutenant
Oct 11, 2012
108
OptimisticOctavio on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
I think that Witchdoctor should not only get more epics, but also have their epics count for spell attacks. Currently Witchdoctor's epics only have a chance to activate from a wand attack. IMO, Witchdoctor should focus on getting spell power, because Witchdoctors get many spells. Also, they do not get much weapon power. Epics would be much more useful if it initiated because of a spell. In certain cases, such as Mournsong, an infinite range attack, they might be out of range. In this case Mojo Echo would not be able to reach the target, a resolution might be that the Mojo Echo just has no chance to cast. Only would Mojo Echo have a chance at casting after an infinite range attack if the target was in range. Therefore I think that Witchdoctor should not only get more epics, but also have their epics count for spell attacks. Thanks for taking the time to read my post!
Welcome to the Message Boards Octavio!
Developer
Our highest damage output is our sword which I have yet to ever see a super critical...

It appears to be set up correctly. Can anybody else confirm whether or not they've seen all three crits from the Mojo Blade line?

Considering that it's a WILL based attack you should see it crit a lot on BUC and SWB. (Especially if you buff WILL first.)
Lieutenant
Feb 02, 2013
119
Ratbeard on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
Our highest damage output is our sword which I have yet to ever see a super critical...

It appears to be set up correctly. Can anybody else confirm whether or not they've seen all three crits from the Mojo Blade line?

Considering that it's a WILL based attack you should see it crit a lot on BUC and SWB. (Especially if you buff WILL first.)
I can indeed confirm. Mojo Blade is Basically an Assassin's Strike that can be activated by anyone, Ignores armor, and is based on spell power(but damage outputted by it is physical damage). I just think there should be a way to temporarily increase spell power in exchange for something (ex. take 10% more damage, but receive a 25% spell power boost for 5 turns). And yes, Mojo Blade/Reaver can indeed critical
Lieutenant
Oct 11, 2012
108
Ratbeard on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
Our highest damage output is our sword which I have yet to ever see a super critical...

It appears to be set up correctly. Can anybody else confirm whether or not they've seen all three crits from the Mojo Blade line?

Considering that it's a WILL based attack you should see it crit a lot on BUC and SWB. (Especially if you buff WILL first.)
I can confirm that I have seen a super Mojo Blade/Reaver (I have seen both). I have done both on my Witchdoctor, so maybe they were just unlucky.
Lieutenant
Feb 14, 2014
184
If you were to take a closer look at our spells, you would see that they are powered by Spell Power, not Will. And I can confirm, that I have seen no gear what so ever, give additional spell power. Which really contradicts Witchdoctor spells, why are we gathering Will, when we should be gathering Spell Power? The only additional Spell Power we get is from doubloons, which makes our spells sky rocket! I would really like to see spell power boosts that come with gear.
Developer
TheHoodooQueen on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
If you were to take a closer look at our spells, you would see that they are powered by Spell Power, not Will. And I can confirm, that I have seen no gear what so ever, give additional spell power. Which really contradicts Witchdoctor spells, why are we gathering Will, when we should be gathering Spell Power? The only additional Spell Power we get is from doubloons, which makes our spells sky rocket! I would really like to see spell power boosts that come with gear.
Hey Hoodoo Queen--

Your spell's base damage is indeed calculated using Spell Power; however, your chance to land a crit will be based on a comparison of your primary stat (WILL) versus your target.

WILL also provides a damage bonus to almost all of your spells and staffy weapon attacks. You can see how much bonus damage you get from WILL by inspecting your will-based weapon (wand or staff). The bonus will be called out.

WILL is also important for boosting non-damage aspects of spells-- for example, all of your summons will appear much higher level if your will is boosted-- I've seen some fun threads where witchdoctors compete to see the highest level summon they can achieve.

And finally, I can also confirm for you that there *are* items out there to boost Spell Power (and most of them are quite low level and easy to obtain):

http://www.pirate101central.com/wiki/Ability:Mojo_Mastery
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Something really should be done about witchdoctor damage. We need to be able to increase spell power as mentioned above, so our spells can actually do some decent damage. I just lost a PVP match in which i had 1500 health, and got killed in one shot by a swashbuckler who did a mega-assassin, and not while hidden. The only spell that we have that can compare to that is mojo reaver. Now imagine the damage on that hit I took if the opponent was hidden. Witches can never do anything even close to that type of damage.
Developer
stormy quentin ver... on Aug 11, 2015 wrote:
Something really should be done about witchdoctor damage. We need to be able to increase spell power as mentioned above, so our spells can actually do some decent damage. I just lost a PVP match in which i had 1500 health, and got killed in one shot by a swashbuckler who did a mega-assassin, and not while hidden. The only spell that we have that can compare to that is mojo reaver. Now imagine the damage on that hit I took if the opponent was hidden. Witches can never do anything even close to that type of damage.
A power to boost spell power? That's doable.

I'm making a list of cool ideas for the next update-- keep 'em coming!
Lieutenant
Feb 02, 2013
119
Ratbeard on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
Hey Hoodoo Queen--

Your spell's base damage is indeed calculated using Spell Power; however, your chance to land a crit will be based on a comparison of your primary stat (WILL) versus your target.

WILL also provides a damage bonus to almost all of your spells and staffy weapon attacks. You can see how much bonus damage you get from WILL by inspecting your will-based weapon (wand or staff). The bonus will be called out.

WILL is also important for boosting non-damage aspects of spells-- for example, all of your summons will appear much higher level if your will is boosted-- I've seen some fun threads where witchdoctors compete to see the highest level summon they can achieve.

And finally, I can also confirm for you that there *are* items out there to boost Spell Power (and most of them are quite low level and easy to obtain):

http://www.pirate101central.com/wiki/Ability:Mojo_Mastery
I forgot about those items, I don't really use them too often. I just though a spell power increase power for witchdoctors would be cool(at least for book 15 update anyways) I digress, Will is underrated by a lot LOL.
Ensign
Mar 04, 2010
27
Ratbeard on Aug 10, 2015 wrote:
Our highest damage output is our sword which I have yet to ever see a super critical...

It appears to be set up correctly. Can anybody else confirm whether or not they've seen all three crits from the Mojo Blade line?

Considering that it's a WILL based attack you should see it crit a lot on BUC and SWB. (Especially if you buff WILL first.)
Hey Ratbeard,

My Witchdoctor is my main so I get to see Mojo Blade line frequently. I dont see it a lot because I hope to kill MOBS prior to having them stand next to me.

When I have occasion to use it I have seen it in all three levels. It is spectacular when it goes Super - not often but I have seen it.

I will add that my will is boosted as far as I am able to boost it, with the sacrifice of a good portion of health, so this may be what causes it to trigger all three levels.
Ensign
May 23, 2015
33
Ratbeard on Aug 11, 2015 wrote:
A power to boost spell power? That's doable.

I'm making a list of cool ideas for the next update-- keep 'em coming!
I have an idea that might just be the ticket. It is not overpowered yet would bring some balance for us. Since we are so vulnerable to melee damage and do not have armor to speak of without added gear how about something in line with nefarious defense that moo uses where we can activate a spell for 3 rounds or so that teleports the opponent away. I don't want to make us overpowered yet with the absence of charm this could be a good alternative. Another solution would be to adjust weapons with a suitable attack range since there are currently only two wands that have any decent range and are next to impossible to obtain. This would be an improvement since we are suppose to be ranged attackers in the first place. Unlike musketeers who can lay bombs and traps for protection we have nothing of that sort. Is this doable?
.
Commodore
Feb 02, 2013
838
Ratbeard on Aug 11, 2015 wrote:
A power to boost spell power? That's doable.

I'm making a list of cool ideas for the next update-- keep 'em coming!
perhaps overprotection for privateers, please ratbeard im begging you be santa for all privateers and give us this lovely gift
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Ratbeard, PVP is becoming more and more frustrating by the day. I keep facing swashbucklers and losing. I am at rank hero, so I am not facing low rank players. I feel like I should quit, but knowing myself, I probably will just keep on trying and losing. I have been doing a lot of PVP over the years, you might have seen if you look over at central, I enjoy 1v1 alot, but this current set up in ranked PVP is just so bad for witches.

My latest loss: I got killed in one shot by a hidden buckler from across the board, in his 2nd turn, he did a charge, then a bunch of epics to kill me. Of course I have no hope of dodging. Game over just like that.

Witch attacks are so weak compared to others. We are so fragile and weak. We cant dodge at all. Our epics are terrible. On top of that, we have no good unique powers. Other classes can get all of our top attacks through gear. Except for reaver, which is really nothing when you consider how much damage assassin strikes alone can do (I mentioned in another post that a mega assassin killed me when I had 1500 health, not even a hidden attack).

Sorry to complain, but PVP at higher ranks as a witch just does not seem much fun.
Lieutenant
Dec 19, 2011
133
Regarding my other post, I would also like to mention that I didnt just feel like I had a good chance in central matches, but in regular no-rules PVP matches also. Ranked has many disadvantages for witches, such as:

1) No corner strategy is usually possible, due to the boards not having corners
2) Charm is now banned
3) The board is smaller
4) I used to be able to use frozen tide to take a turn away from approaching enemies, but thats no longer possible
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